Hello and welcome to ASCP SD Talk.
I am Ella Kressman, licensed esthetician certified organic skincare formulator and content contributor
for associated skincare professionals.
I am Aggie Stasek, licensed esthetician and ASCP's education program manager.
So Maggie, remember the other day when you asked me what her exesome had no idea?
Mm-hmm.
I know now.
Oh.
Well, I'm excited that you're going to share with us.
Not only do I know, but I have a song.
I'm going to share it for the end because it's awesome.
Cool.
So exesomes.
And the reason I know now is because all of a sudden I see them everywhere.
Yeah, they are trending.
Trending big time.
So I'm like, what are these?
They sound so scientific.
So I looked it up.
And what I found out is they're best defined as extracellular vesicles that are released
from cells upon fusion of an intermediate endocytic compartment.
Hmm.
That's easy.
Wow.
Ah, noted.
There it goes on.
These multivescular bodies, MVP, MVPs, they bond with a plasma membrane.
That sounds like a lot.
So I had to dig deeper because I get it kind of.
Basically, they're this tiny little structure that is formed inside of a cell and contains
some of the cell's proteins like DNA and RNA.
So of course, we've heard a lot about RNA in the past few years.
And exesomes, they get released into the blood or any other areas.
And then they travel all around sharing messages.
So what those messages are are different for different types of cells.
They're in well-intended cells, blood cells and so on.
And even in malicious cells like cancer cells.
They are generated by every single type and they carry nucleic acid, proteins, lipids
and metabolites.
What they do, they communicate long and far distances, different things.
They are attracted to areas of inflammation.
Interesting.
So it's important to note that when we're looking at where these are used in the aesthetic
industry or in aesthetic treatments or in aesthetic products, basically they're well-informed
messengers and they release, they're released from stem cells.
So stem cells are something that we've heard a lot and we're talking about human or mammalian
stem cells, not plant stem cells, just to clarify.
And because they're attracted naturally to areas of inflammation, this is where they
go and basically carry messages of growth factors and other anti-inflammatory or immune
supportive antioxidants to where they need to be.
So it's very important when we have wound injury or perceived injury.
And so when you're thinking about this, where would we see wounding injury perceived injury
or inflammation?
Well, it's like almost every treatment we do.
Absolutely.
Almost every condition that we have as well.
Specifically, when we're looking at rosacea, there has been some amazing advancements for
exosomes in rosacea, amazing advancements for even key loiting.
Because if you look at the mechanism of repairing a key loite, it's basically off because it
didn't get the right messages and it continues to not get the right reparative messages.
So exosomes are using for that, we'll get into that in a little bit more.
But sounds very, very, very similar to PRP.
Yes.
So PRP is platelet-rich protein.
What's the biggest difference between PRP and exosomes besides new technology?
Is the exosomes are more potent and reliable treatment therapy than PRP or PRFM, which is
platelet-rich fibrin matrix.
And those are used, both of them, all three of them, are used to expedite wound healing
process in order to create new skin cells, collagen and blood vessels.
So this is why we've seen this quite often, PRP combined with microneedling.
The downside of PRP and PRFM is that those cells are unpredictable.
So let's first talk about PRP.
We know that that is drawn from our own blood.
So I would come in, get a service, I'd have my blood drawn, it would be spun, separated.
My PRP would be then applied, injected, whatever the therapy was.
This is proven to be very beneficial or effective for like knee pain, for example.
But the mode is that this cells are going in and initiating repair, but they're the
concentrated cells.
So they're not carrying all the baggage of the years before.
The problem with that is that they are also unpredictable and they would depend on my
age, my health, and how many growth factors I have.
Okay, interesting.
I mean, in my perception always has been too that they're intended truly to heal and rebuild.
Right?
To start anew.
Right.
The stem cells would be the very basic building block of a cell.
Exosomes, they come from stem cells, they come from fat, from bone marrow, or from an umbilical
cord.
And they contain many growth factors that signal regeneration.
So it's an even more concentrated version of PRP.
Hold that thought.
We'll be right back.
DMK is the world leader in Paramedical Skin Revision Education.
With certification programs designed to give licensed professionals a thorough understanding
of the skin and an in-depth study of the DMK concept of remove, rebuild, protect, maintain.
Created by the Botanical Visionary Denae Montague King, DMK offers skin revision training
and education for all ages, skin conditions, and ethnicities in more than 35 countries
harnessing the body's innate healing mechanisms to change the health of the skin.
Learn more at denaeimking.com.
That's d-a-n-n-e-m-k-i-n-g.com.
Elle Bana, Australian born, globally loved.
Elle Bana's story is simple.
They love lashes and brows.
They shoot for the stars and lift lashes to new heights.
Their addiction is real, their passion is popping, and there is nothing more they crave
than offering excellence, service, and innovation in products.
Elle Bana Lash Lift allows you to offer your customers luscious, lifted lashes that can
last up to 12 weeks in one safe 20-minute treatment.
Learn more at ellebana-usa.com.
Okay, here we go.
Let's get back to the podcast.
This is the part that I think is kind of interesting is where they come from.
This is going to be controversial as far as ex-semes.
They come many times from embryonic cells because those cells have the most regenerative
potential.
So, platelet-rich protein would be the old, most unpredictable, and stem cells and then
exosomes would be the most.
They still have some dependency on age and health, but that's because the code that's
written into them is going to be responsible for the quality of the message that comes
out.
So, that's really fascinating and the whole concept of skincare ingredients coming from
an embryonic source, if you will, is not new.
That's been around for a really long time and definitely very controversial.
But to get the most benefit to your point, that's where they're sourced, right?
You have one donated fetus and then they're synthesizing all those ingredients in a petri
dish.
Like a plant stem cell.
Yeah.
So, one donor, not requiring multiple donors, donors tested for quality of whatever their
markers are and then it goes forth from there.
Would you use an embryonic exosome facial product?
Yeah, you would.
Yeah.
I don't know if I would.
Why not?
It's a great question.
I don't know.
It just feels because of the source of those exosomes.
Yeah.
To be honest, because I would have to think about it and where did it come from.
If I didn't know and it was just an exosome serum, yes, if it worked.
But those exosomes are coming from a lab.
Yeah.
It's not.
I'm not saying it's rational saying this is my train of thought.
And I don't know that I would be alone and I don't know that you would be alone.
I think there's probably, I also think if I was, let's say at a condition where I had
bad scarring, had a really bad burn and I needed regeneration in like a basal layer,
I would not turn that down in a treatment.
But in a daily thing, I think I would struggle back and forth with that.
Yeah, I totally get that.
And I think part of this was brought up when my dad had broke his hip, like really, really
bad and he had to get donor graft bone.
And I thought, I thought of all the things.
And this is going off in a totally different tangent.
But you have to, I guess for me to think about putting it on willingly every day, I don't
know.
But I think that it's one thing to say, you need to have bone grafted and you're getting
that bone from a donor.
That's different from, I'm going to apply this cream for beauty purposes.
And it is containing whatever that ingredient is that came from the lab, not the lab, but
in your mind, you're thinking, wow, the ingredients for this beauty cream came from a embryonic
source or it came from, I don't know what, but some other human, right?
It feels controversial.
Sure.
It feels controversial.
I would think so too.
So I'm going to have to sit with that and think because I also think if it works, I
would have to think really hard.
And the way that they're using them now, they do have topical, there is topical skincare
available with exosomes.
And I imagine we're going to see more and more and more of that.
And maybe my position would change too, maybe, but basically for topical skincare, there is
like a few companies, most of these are seeing in the medical market.
And then in clinic skin rejuvenation, like post deep peels or post microneedling, similar
to how they're using PRP.
The other place that they're using this a lot is in hair restoration.
Oh, yeah.
And I think I've actually heard that.
And I very successfully from one of our here.
And I know you know that I struggle, I'm so afraid to lose my hair that this is something
I would consider for sure.
So when we're talking about procedure versus daily use, I would absolutely consider a daily
use hair product.
Yeah.
The Kiloid scar revision thing that blows my mind because my perception has always been,
you know, if you're prone to Kiloids or if you have a Kiloid, I mean, kind of it is
what it is.
If you are attempting to remove that Kiloid, that's a wound and your skin is just going
to regrow more Kiloids, right?
I think that is a great point.
There's prone and then there's people who get them.
I mean, like some people have gotten them.
With this question came up when I was training overseas and they were asking for certain
contraindications.
Somebody had a like appendix surgery and their scar Kiloid, but nothing else.
There's no history of Kiloid, no other present.
There's no other presentation of Kiloids.
And so they were worried about giving her a chemical peel, a mandelica acid chemical
peel.
Yeah.
Fair enough.
I was thinking on our previous podcast about European standards, they're heightened.
They're worried about everything, even like different conditions and such.
So I had to do some research and I found that there are acquired Kiloids and susceptible
Kiloids.
I'm curious if this Kiloid scar revision is done for both.
But if you think about Kiloid formation and that potential, hereditary potential, it's
because there's a bad message being sent.
Grow a mountain instead of plant a field.
Oh, I love that.
And so growing of that mountain, that signal, that instruction, because we're under attack
and we need it, the theory is if we remove this and apply exosomes whose messages plant
the field, then that's how it would come back.
That is so cool.
Yeah.
And they're having success with that.
I think they did a study with 64 different patients and had success with all of them.
Wow.
Yeah.
At any rate, you can research and research and research these and you can get down a rabbit
hole.
But let me tell you an easy, easy way to remember what exosomes do.
Do you know I like reggae?
It's like my favorite thing.
One of my favorite things after skincare.
So there's the Bama Arley song, Exodus.
And so in my head, as I'm researching, I'm thinking of that song.
I'm like, exosomes, messengers of the skin cells.
So now you are welcome listeners.
Maggie, you're welcome.
Every time you hear that song, you will remember what exosomes do and basically that is to
enhance communication of proper function, whatever that may be.
And the other part of exosomes that's cool is they help fill in for all skin cells.
So healthy production of melanocytes for dermal cells and for keratinocytes.
You are welcome.
I love it.
Now listeners, we really want to hear from you.
What are your thoughts on exosomes?
Be sure to let us know.
Slide into our DMs, comment on our social media posts or send us an email at getconnected
at ascpskincare.com.
We want to know all the details.
In the meantime, thank you for listening to ASCP STTOC.
For more information on this episode or for ways to connect with Maggie or myself or to
learn more about ASCP, check out the show notes.
And stay tuned for the next episode of ASCP STTOC.
Thank you.
♪ Happy month ♪