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Hello and welcome to ASCP-SCTOC.
I am Ella Christman, licensed esthetician, certified organic skin care formulator and
content contributor for Associated Skin Care Professionals.
I am Aggie Stasek, licensed esthetician and ASCP's Education Program Manager.
And we have a shout out today to new skin by Tracy.
Hi, Tracy.
We are glad you're listening and we hope you loved the summit.
What's up, Tracy?
So today we're going to talk about a lot of things.
There's a lot going on in the aesthetic world and we need to chat about it.
Yeah.
Maggie.
Yeah.
What are your thoughts on this?
Can we talk about something that baffles my mind?
It's so funny because trends come and go, right?
This is one trend that I can see being cute and I'm glad it's being delivered on one
side in a certain kind of way.
But I'm nervous about the other way it's being delivered.
But anyways, Maggie, what are your thoughts on tattooed freckles?
I think I'm baffled too.
This is so weird to me because as estheticians and in the beauty industry, we have been so
obsessed with smoothing out the skin, eliminating unwanted pigment.
And then we're going back in and tattooing it.
I don't get it.
My mind is blown.
And let's talk about that a lot of times it's with permanent or semi-permanent makeup.
But sometimes it's not.
Yeah.
And sometimes it can look really cute.
You look youthful, like super youthful, like a super tree.
Super youthful.
That's where my mind is going like strawberry shortcake.
That's what I was thinking.
Or a punkie Brewster or Pippi Longsocking.
That's where like super youthful or you can look like you stayed out in the sun too long
depending.
So I'm assuming that people of my age, which is 45 in one week, are not getting this.
I would agree with you.
And the other thing I would know is that, so I have seen this like in real time on people,
it is too perfect.
Too perfectly placed, the freckles themselves are too ideal.
It's fake.
Mapped.
Mapped.
Do you remember where of, I'm not going to say that you're my age.
That's your business.
But do you remember in the 1980s being obsessed with Madonna and her mole?
Oh yeah.
And the cone bra.
Just saying.
Thank God that was not a style.
Can you imagine a lot of people got moles tattooed on their face, but it was with regular
tattoo ink, not the semi-permanent ink.
And they would fade from that dark brown to green or purple?
Yes.
And I was just thinking that, I mean, and you said it, this is semi-permanent ink meant
for what it is, permanent cosmetics.
But tattooing does fade to like this bluish greenish, weirdness.
You would never want that on your face.
And it goes two years.
So I know that personally, I've seen a lot and shout out to those who are doing permanent
makeup well, because there's a lot of work that looks fantastic.
One of them was just last week I saw somebody who had their eyeliner done four years ago
and I was like, get out.
It looks so good.
But there's also those who don't.
Long story short.
Like make sure if you're going to commit to this.
There's a couple of things.
One, you're going to somebody reputable.
And number two, that you have thoroughly researched the procedure because I think relating to,
I don't want to say the younger audience because I feel young, but like people in their 20s,
this is who I'm imagining gets this.
I'm imagining that they are like, ooh, going to be excited about different cosmetic procedures
without really evaluating all of the risks.
So take a quick Google trip and say tattooed freckles gone wrong.
That's a good one or tattoo freckles risk.
And I did that.
And I just wanted to share some of the headlines.
One is woman's freckle tattoo on face goes badly wrong.
I tattooed freckles on my face thinking they'd fade.
Women are being scared by botched DIY freckles.
An influencer 22 who was left scarred and temporary blind from this procedure.
And then tic-tac-or gets freckled tattoos and it goes horribly wrong.
So great for the tattoo removal industry, but really consider all of that part.
Yeah, I agree totally.
And also side note, if you are getting any kind of permanent makeup, especially freckles,
and you are also seeing any kind of technician, esthetician, whatever it is, be sure that
you're noting this on your intake form, letting them know that you have this permanent makeup
that you have tattooed freckles.
Because they might be trying to remove them.
Scrubbing.
You got some schmutz on your face.
But especially if they're mapped out perfectly like you said, not very important.
Okay, so next question.
I'm a big fan of Botox or preventative aging.
And there's now a new kid on the block that is boasting different benefits.
Now before we talk about the new kid on the block, let's talk about what's been available
for the majority of time.
Botox was the first and the most popular, the hero, but we also have Xeomyn and Dysport.
So the way that they behave, Dysport and Botox are the same as far as the protein, same
active ingredient.
The Xeomyn is similar, but just a slightly different molecular makeup, same molecule,
just different shape.
And that's what they're calling the Xeomyn is the naked protein.
My experience I've had Xeomyn, I've not had Dysport, but it didn't last.
It metabolized super quick out of my system.
And I know other people who like it.
But at any rate, early on in my preventative journey, I would have to get injections once
or twice a year.
Now it's about every three or four months, depending, about every four months, so three
times a year.
And that's right in line with where they're seeing traditional Botox last.
But now there is a new kid on the block, Daxify, who they're touting, their benefits are the
last six months, so less frequent appointments, but twice the price.
So what are your thoughts on Daxify, this new kid on the block for neurotoxins?
Well, if we're talking twice the price, but lasting longer, I mean, same thing, right?
Pay less, go in more frequent or pay more, last longer.
I mean, I would just say, you want Botox or do you want Daxify?
Would you try it?
Yeah, I would try it.
All right, let's go.
Let's make an appointment.
Let's do it Ella.
You first.
Just on in my beginning.
Yeah, wait, and then I'll wait 15 minutes.
And they think that's, I would try it too.
Absolutely have no problems, especially because it's temporary-ish.
But I do want to see a little bit more information on it too.
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Okay, here we go.
Let's get back to the podcast.
I'm curious.
I mean, obviously it makes sense that more and more injectables would come out in science
advances, but I also wonder if people, well, we talked about people removing their injections
in general, but I wonder if people are scaling away from Botox and saying, I'm not doing this
anymore, it's only lasting me a few months and it's a waste of my money.
I think that I've had those thoughts in my head too.
I think where I've been able to stretch out my appointment, I mean, in all fairness, I
feel like I look in my early 30s, I pass for that often because I started the preventative
journey earlier.
I know that a lot of people don't, like you should never get it.
No, no, no, no, no.
And there are a lot of topical options for peptides and such that will inhibit in their
own way, but inhibit some of that contraction.
It's just a faster way to get there to stop it altogether.
I will say in all fairness too, that I have had not the injectors fault, but just different
injections where I've had this weird like bat eyebrow or one, like I have, like I call
it my winking eye because this must be stronger, my ocular muscle must be stronger on this
side because I'll get it, it'll soften like the glabella, but this muscle pulls tighter
so I have one eyebrow higher than the other.
So it's something that it's tuned in and dialed in.
So I would be nervous to try a new one, but I still am going to do it and support it with
topical peptides so that it extends the life of my Botox or Daxify if we try it.
Well, and that's the way to do it in general, right?
So this one, I know you're going to be excited about this one, but what are your thoughts
of epidermal growth factors?
That's a loaded question.
I agree with them.
Okay, so there's an interesting thing.
So in April to June of 2021, this is how it came about.
Like I thought, oh, this is interesting.
I want to talk to Maggie about it.
There was a review of epidermal growth factors in aesthetics and regenerative medicine.
And usually when you take like these scientific reviews, some agency or some different research
university or something, they'll say, I'm going to review all these different articles.
So when you're researching and you see a review, that's what it is.
I'm going to review all these articles and come up with a conclusion, what I see some
commonalities and what they found as far as epidermal growth factors.
There's two keys that we should talk about today that there were similarities between
anti-aging and wound healing as far as those.
And mostly that process for aging and wound healing or anti-aging and wound healing is
the same oxidative and repair mechanisms.
So those were both similar.
So as far as epidermal growth factors, what they are, is there something that is able
to biostimulate fibroblast and keratinocytes to restructure, which is what's happening
when we're aging is that process slows down or when we have wound healing, whatever the
four stages of wound healing you're in, there's proliferation.
And the epidermal growth factors were more effective when they were applied as injections
in this review or as transdermal patches versus topical.
And they think it's because of the mechanism of delivery.
And that makes total sense to me.
And for some reason, I feel like this came up and it may have been a few years, but I
feel like this came up in the medical industry.
If somebody needed like a new replacement, for instance, I don't know if it was something
along the lines of stem cells or maybe it was growth factors, they were saying you could
not take growth factors and inject it into that body part.
They had decided that was a no, they were not allowing it.
But that would be hugely effective.
Like if you had loss of cartilage in your knee and degeneration, why wouldn't you inject
things like growth factors and stem cells to help rebuild?
So that would be cool for connective tissues.
And can you imagine if that was the case for connective tissue injuries?
Like a sprain or strain or like this MCO?
I think that would be cool.
I wonder why they said that.
Yeah, and maybe that's changed.
But I remember that was like a big controversy for a while.
The other thing though, as I was researching, because I wanted to, you know, the rabbit
hole that we go down when we're looking into these things, something I found too on cancer.com
is the epidermal growth factor for that is a thing also.
So that would be where the receptor protein signals pathways that control cell division.
So if we're looking at basal cell carcinoma, that would expedite that growth factor would
increase the way that those lesions would grow or melanoma that they would grow a lot
faster because they divide more rapidly.
That was interesting too.
I don't think that the topical or an injectable would have an influence on it, but it was
something that was interesting to me.
That is interesting.
When we think about people that just have any type of condition like eczema, psoriasis,
things of that nature, I would imagine that applying growth factors to the skin would
stimulate those conditions in negative ways.
And cancer also probably is a factor where growth factors and something like cancer do
not play well together.
That is a great point.
And so in the world of cancer, and I think same thing with eczema and psoriasis, this would
be beneficial is that there's drugs that block the epidermal growth factor proteins so that
that slows down that cell proliferation.
And I think that's pretty cool.
So something to keep an eye on in the science world.
Now, out of the science world, back to pop culture, have you seen love is blind the last
season?
No, I'm like, nope, haven't been watching.
I know you don't have Netflix, but I wanted to ask you anyways.
So when I'm watching that, first of all, I'm fascinated, you know, how I am with reality
TV, but I want to know you're, I was distracted.
I have to be honest this season because of the eyelash extensions being so bad.
Really so bad.
There's this girl and I don't mean girl number one to blonde.
I forget her name because I don't care.
But hers are so bad.
There's gaps in theirs.
They're not done really well at all, but there was mean girl number two.
The burnout hers were bad too.
And I just thought, y'all, what are we doing?
Like that's not.
So I want to know what are your thoughts on these extreme eyelash extensions?
It surprises me that that is a thing right now because I thought extreme eyelashes were
years ago.
No, not according to, not according to love is blind.
Yes.
And I see why they're going blind because they have my eyelash extension.
I don't think they can still see who they picked.
They're bad.
Like I would wake up with red eyes.
So there's, there's a lot of other shows that I watch too.
And I think like a teen mom and just different ones.
I'm like, wow, that's got to be doing some damage.
But now I watched an old movie like late nineties, early 2000s when I thought, oh, their eyes
are so naked because we're so used to seeing people with those long, luscious lashes now,
but it doesn't mean you have to go that extreme.
And if you do keep up on your maintenance, that's just me being very judgy and I, I don't
apologize.
So curious about extreme eyelash extensions.
And I will disclaim that I do love the look of eyelash extensions.
And I loved when I had them, but let's just not go crazy.
I agree.
Now listeners, we really want to hear from you.
What are your thoughts on tattooed freckles, the new Botox on the block, epidermal growth
factors, and really all things aesthetics?
Be sure to let us know, comment on our social media or send us an email at get connected
at ascpskincare.com.
We want to know all the details.
In the meantime, thank you for listening to ASCP ST talk for more information on this
episode or for ways to connect with Maggie or myself.
Check out the show notes.
Stay tuned for the next episode of ascp ST talk.
Thank you.
a lot.
Bye.
Bye.
Bye.