Love Ya with Dylan Mulvaney

Picture Miami. Picture its beaches. Picture three radio journalists. Assassinated in cold blood. This is silenced. The radio murders. You left the body there for a reason. It was the calling card. It's like the mafia used to do. The mastermind has never been caught. To find him, we had to go deep into a world of drugs and darkness. And there were these hints of a much bigger conspiracy. This year I clearly gave with me in light. I'm Osvylosian. Listen to silenced. The radio murders. On the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts. Or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Skylar Baylor and I want to tell you about my new podcast, Dear Skylar. I was the first transgender athlete to compete in any sport on an NCAA Division 1 men's team. I try to answer as many questions as possible. That's why on Dear Skylar, every episode revolves around giving an answer to common questions that I'm asked. I talk to all kinds of incredible guests and friends, people whose lived experiences, expertise and wisdom can help you and me gain insight into how to answer these questions. Listen to Dear Skylar on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, and everywhere you listen to podcasts. It was a Hollywood movie come true and I was the star. That's Damon Loner. In 2013, he founded what became known as the most elite sex club in the world. Sanctum. Join me, Carly Shortino, as we explore how this luxury sex empire was built and how it ultimately turned Damon's life upside down. Listen to Sanctum on mass on iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you find your favorite shows. Welcome to season four, everybody. This is season four of Dear Chelsea. Thank you for helping make us a sweet success. Okay. Hello, Catherine. Hi, Chelsea. Hi, what's up? Oh, my God, season four, so many things have happened. I know I feel like these little communities are forming. People are reaching out to each other. I can't tell you how many times somebody will hear someone call in and they contact me and they'll be like, listen, I have the perfect solution for them or I can connect them with someone who can help them. And so I pass their little email along and it's just really wonderful. I wish Bernice could call in my dog. I wish she could call in because I want to know what's on her mind. All I know is, all I know is I love her ever since birth passed away slash got put down only because it was the end of the road. Not because I wanted to get rid of him. Can you imagine if he pissed me off and I just put him down? Anyway, Bernice has been a sweetheart. Just the last time she was in bed. I usually have to force her up into my bed, which I had to stop doing because she had this really wicked cough. And I say wicked because I'm from Boston, the Boston area, but she had this really wicked cough. And I was like, God, is she getting like second hand spoke from all my joints? And then I was like, is she smoking her own joints? Yeah. And then I sent her the doctor and they kept giving her cough medicine and cough medicine and cough pills. And I was like, it's not a cough. It's deeper than that. So then we took her to another vet and they found out that she has a collapsed trachea, which they kind of intimated. Carla, my assistant kind of tried to make it like it was my fault for picking her up her whole life. And I told Carla to just take it down an notch and shut the front door because that I don't pick her up by her fucking throat. First of all, secondly, so now when I go up, she goes up to doggy stairs, I put a leash on her, I guide her up, you know, to trapper. I like a lobster. But now last night, and this has been happening. Yeah. She when I come back for my tour weekends, because you know, I've been on my tour, I come back and she comes, I guide her up the steps and she doesn't go down now. Oh, she woke up like three times last night. And she was like, I was like, I put the light on so she could see the steps so she can go down, you know, to her doggy bed. But then she just looked at me circled back around, dug her feet in, and went back to sleep. So she's sleeping with me through the night, which is I've never ever had this experience when Bert was alive. And you know, she again, like any marginalized woman, she has been marginalized. And since Bert has gone and he required so much attention and cuteness and neediness, they get like mad at you. They get, I think Mimsie's like still mad at me me specifically for getting these two puppies. Oh, yeah, she is. She's mad at you. And I won't I was I was like, oh, I got to get another puppy because I like to have two. But I'm going to wait until the fall. A, because that's irresponsible because I'm going to be traveling a lot during the summer and be I want this time alone with my daughter. Now I understand it. It's true. Like, I definitely feel I have a lot of like mothers guilt of I'm not spending enough time with Mimsie. And now that the puppies are like the squeaky wheels in my face all the time. So I'm working on that, like taking her fresh walks, giving her actual love, which she like also sometimes doesn't want because she's like, I just want to like snuggle you. I don't want you to snuggle me back. She's very that. Oh, really? Yeah, she like wants to be like between your legs, but like she won't be in your front nook. She won't be spooned. She doesn't have it. She can't be in your front nook. No translation under your arm, everyone. Exactly. You didn't see Catherine's justiculation. So I understand exactly what that meant. Yeah, but I appreciate the one on one time. And she's so sweet, Bernice, and I just love her so much. And I'm just so grateful that I have dogs. In other non canine news, I got these glasses, these progressive glasses. I got about six pair made, three sunglasses and three regular glasses. And the guy explained to me that the top part is for to see distance. The middle part is to see intermediate. I'm like, what the fuck is intermediate? And the bottom part is for a close up. But when I sit on a plane, if I look down the print on the book, because I like to read on my plane rides, yeah, I have to hold my head in a certain way so that it makes the print readable. Yeah. And I don't like these. And a lot of people warn me about these. And I'm going to take them all back and have them. I want bifocals is what I want. Yeah, just two, not three. I don't need three compartments. And by the way, he was like, Oh, I put a prescription on the top. I go, there is no prescription on the top. I've had LASIK. And he said, no, there's a light prescription. And I'm like, I don't think that there is. So I mean, I guess, ophthalmologists are right up there with veterinarians in my book. Yeah. They don't seem to have a real concrete answer to anything. Everything's vague. Why would you need intermediate seeing like between distance and short sighted? Why do you need to see another subset? They're famously have only been two for a very long time. Yeah. So I guess the I guess people don't like the line in the bifocal. I don't give a shit though. I mean, I'm going to be how old am I 48? I mean, at certain point, I just have to give up. Yeah. Brad had that happen once where he went to a new optometrist and this guy was like, no, no, I know your real prescription. All of the doctors you've been seeing for the last 15 years are wrong. That's like, when you get your bras fitted, you know, someone's like, Oh, these are the bras. This is the going to be the bra that fits you. And it is for the first 20 minutes. And then after you wear it, you're like, no, my tits look like what are the cones? Yeah, I think that 40s look where my tits look pointy. Yeah. And you just get stabbed in weird spots and it's no good. I don't know about bra fitting, but definitely I've been wearing glasses. It's like third grade. And this doctor was like, Oh, hey, you know what? Your prescription, let your eyes do the work. Let your eyes work for it. And then he gave me this prescription that was less. So everything was blurry and I had to like squinted everything. That doesn't make any fucking sense. Yeah, work for what? And then also, you know, my favorite book, letting go by David Hawkins in it, he talks about letting go of the fact that you can't see and just not wearing glasses and that his vision miraculously came back to him. So I try that for about a month. That did not, that's the only section of the book. I'm like, listen, buddy, I don't know what kind of magic you're working. You guys are just like bootstrapping your eyes. My corny is just going to repair itself because I decided to let go. If you believe enough, it will. But I am in a great meditation zone. Yes. Yeah, I'm really feeling my meditations lately. I do that. I've been doing my Chopra app and I do these courses, but you know, sometimes you don't really feel it. You just feel like you're sitting there thinking, but I'm really able to like stop my thoughts. And I'm like going to this like place, like this light place. And it's very relaxed. And now I'm craving it. I mean, this has been, I don't know how many years I've been meditating, probably like four or five now, but it's been great. But I'm in a zone right now and I'm liking it a lot. Do you, what's it called when you can like cast your spirit somewhere else? That's what I feel like I'm doing. Like I'm not in my body. Astral projection. Yes. Astral projection. Is that above my asshole? That's exactly what it is. Astral projection. Well, that's what I think I'm doing anyway. Who knows if that's what I'm doing, but it feels like I'm not in my body. Like I'm in some light filled atmosphere with my mom and my brother. They're always with me. So that's fun. I love that. And you can visit them anytime. Yeah. My, I picture my mom like a little nymph flying around like a little Sphinx or no Sphinx or a fairy. A fairy. It's like that Greek mythology thing like when they fly around and they're right. Yeah, a sprite. That's what I think. Like a sprite. And Chelsea, you're about to be traveling a bunch. And I have just announced new stand updates for my little big bitch tour guys. I announced 25 new cities. These are probably a lot of the cities people have been mentioning in the comments. I start out in East Hampton. I go to New York, DC, Durham, North Carolina, LA, Phoenix, Cleveland, Columbus, Pittsburgh, Milwaukee, Chicago, Madison, Portland, to name just some. I will be performing at the Kennedy Center, everybody. That's in DC, October 6th. I'm super psyched to be performing there. There are more. You can go to ChelseaHannler.com. I am on tour. I have dates coming up for the next three months and then more dates coming up in the fall. So those have all been announced. They're on my Instagram page or you can go to ChelseaHannler.com. Thank you. Our first guest of season four is the one who has been getting a ton of attention because she has been very loud and proud about her transition into girlhood. And I am loving it up and I'm loving her Instagram. So please welcome Dylan Mulvaney. Hi Dylan Mulvaney in person and looking beautiful as ever. Thank you, ChelseaHannler. So excited to finally meet you. Oh my god. I got to tell you, this is a full circle moment. I grew up when I was about 13, 14 years old, this, you know, gay boy pre-transition. I had a friend group called the Harlitz and it was me and a bunch of girls, bad bitches. And we used to pass your books around. And that's how we learned about sex. And so I texted them all. It had been a while since I've, you know, talked with them, but I said, you're never going to believe who I'm going to see today. So I just really, it's a very full circle moment. Oh, well, I'm so glad to hear that. Dylan has gained a lot of notoriety and popularity on her TikTok series, Becoming a Girl. Or is it being a girl? Days of Girlhood. Days of Girlhood. Sorry. We just hit day 365 a few weeks ago. Yes. And you had a big celebration. I did a big show, musical baby. I'm Broadway. We had singing, dancing and acting. Oh my god. Talk about a full circle moment. Yes. So I want to ask you so many questions, but let's just start about gaining the confidence and the self-assuredness to follow your pursuit of becoming the real person that you wanted to be. Absolutely. When I was four years old, I came to my mom and I said, mom, I think I'm a girl. And you know, we grew up very Catholic, very conservative. And she... Where did you grow up? The outskirts of San Diego. Okay. And a little town called Alpine. And I was a boy in a dance studio at age three, you know, only boy there dancing. But I came to my mom and I said this and she said, well, God, does it make mistakes? And this was the year 2000. And so there really weren't many resources at all except, you know, the only transness we got to see was a sex worker on NCIS that had been hurt. You know, we hadn't seen trans people experiencing success or happiness or, you know, it was... I don't resent my family or even myself for not allowing me to become this woman that I am now because this was all part of the journey. And finally, you know, those gender thoughts, I pushed them away because when I was starting to discover my sexuality, which is a different thing than gender, I thought that being gay was at the end of the world. I thought really it doesn't, you know, it can't get any worse. And so transness wasn't even allowed to be in my mind. And so I came out as gay at 14. But when you said to your mother that you were four, when you were four, you said, I feel like I'm a girl. And she just was like, God, doesn't make any mistakes. And that was it. We did some, you know, I went to some therapy and again, a very different time. So I'm not resentful at all. But it was then at the pandemic, I was touring with a Broadway musical called The Book of Mormon. And ironic. It's wild. But I was spent my whole life, you know, doing theater playing these male roles. And I, there was no room even in that industry to be trans. And so once the pandemic hit, it was the first time that I didn't even have to see myself playing a part. I was like, who is Dylan really without theater and religion and all these things that had been put on me. And I was a really feminine little boy growing up. And I felt like I stripped parts of my myself away for so many years that I'm now finding again. And I think that's been the most beautiful part is, is getting to finally give into those, those feelings and those desires and those outfits and whatever it might be that brings me euphoria. But during the pandemic, I was like, okay, let's reopen that question of gender. And I identified as non-binary for about a year, went by they, them pronouns. And it still was not where I was supposed to be. And I think it was so daunting making that jump from being a man to then that trans woman title scared the shit out of me. And it's so funny. I don't usually curse, but I'm around you and I kind of feel like I want to let me know a little bit happens. But you have that influence. I thought, you know, non-binary moment of my life was kind of this little cloud that I got to land on for a hot second. And it was not the end of my journey. That's when I finally accepted, I actually, I started hormones while I was non-binary to, you know, feminize my body. And then I took on that she pronoun and it feels so good. Oh, I'm so happy to hear that you followed. You were able to pursue what you felt was necessary to be a complete human being. And I think what people's resistance is to transgender people, to the whole LGBTQIA community is that it's different from what they know. And anything that's different than what anybody knows is scares them for some reason, because it's the same reason people want to hold on to power and don't want to give equality to everybody because they're scared of what they may lose. And their lack of understanding, instead of looking at it as a huge growth opportunity to be like, Oh my God, tell me everything. I want to understand you better. Right. It doesn't come at the front. Well, and they, you know, a lot of people don't have a Dylan in their lives to ask questions. And I think that's kind of why I got online too, was because I wanted to be that friend for people. I wanted to show that I'm not some monster. And it's sad that there are still so many people that are trying to use this really beautiful journey against me and twisting my words and taking things out of context. But at the end of the day, like, I'm happier than I ever have been because I could, I can't imagine going back to that, that other, you know, person, it breaks my heart to think about. Yeah, I would imagine so. So how do you, how do you reconcile that? Like, when you look back at your former life, before you became a woman, how do you frame that time? You know, I try to actually think about it in a very positive, I always do glass half full. Everything that has happened before transition, that was supposed to happen. That was part of my story. I was learning things. And now I feel like now it's all icing on the cake because I actually got to the cake finally. But I just, I don't want to ever resent, you know, there, there are sometimes the mindset of like every day before, you know, I came out was, was absolutely horrible. But no, I had some good times in my life, but I just hadn't entered my full potential at all. You know, when you're locked into yourself, right? And you're like, Oh, this is, this is who I am. This feels right. My intuition has never been more alive within myself. So I'm just, I, I'm trying to stay strong. Yeah. Yeah. And you will be strong. You're already strong. Thank you. You know, there's always going to be bumps in the road and things will happen that will feel like you're, you're getting off course, but it's up to you to remain steadfast and true to who you are, and to follow your truth, because your truth is unlike anyone else's. And people have a easy time forgetting that. I want to talk a little bit about what it takes to actually transition because that is another argument for the reason that people wouldn't be doing it. It's not easy. It's not easy to transition. It's not easy to change your sex that you were born with or to feel like you're not the person that you were meant to be. So talk to me a little bit about that. Well, I really get upset when people say, you know, she woke up one day and just decided she wanted to be a girl. Like this was not a decision. This was who every fiber of my being. And I put in a lot of frickin effort and a lot of, you know, mental gymnastics, a lot of therapy, a lot of soul searching to do this. And it is something that I don't take lightly. I think that this journey that I'm on, you know, going on hormones, those were all huge decisions that I had to make and very private ones. And while, you know, every transition looks completely different, you know, there are trans people that aren't on hormones or that might choose not to get surgeries. But for those of us who need those things for our dysphoria, we need access to them and that we can't be vilified for needing those things. Right. And you recently had facial feminization, right? Oh, babe. I feel as good, right? Yeah, beautiful. And my biggest thing about sharing that process online was that I didn't want people to see it as plastic surgery. I needed them to know that this is like an affirming surgery that can change lives and possibly save lives. And it was so wild to look in the mirror and see what I imagined for the, you know, for the first time to kind of, it was just a soften of my features. I didn't look totally different, but it was a very emotional experience. And I do think like there's power in sharing a story so that people can get like a little look in. Absolutely. I mean, that's what you're doing is freeing other people. When you share your story, you're giving license to other people to share their stories and to follow their dreams. How many surgeries have you had to have thus far? So it's funny. Like, there's really no rulebook to how transitions go. And again, it's like you can, you know, sort of pick and choose what it is based on your euphoria and dysphoria. So, you know, that was because I'm so in the public eye right now, I knew that that was one of the first things that I wanted to do since I am so on display and I was feeling so self-conscious and very upset about my features. And but now I'm actually think I'm going to take a little bit of a step back about talking about my physical transition because first of all, that word influencer scares the shit out of me because I don't want to influence anyone to do anything. But I don't want other trans people, especially young trans people to feel like they have to do something in order to be trans. And so while I do have other plans and other surgeries that I like, I haven't decided how I'm going to necessarily share those because I don't want to set any sort of precedent. That's that's nice and I'm responsible, I'm sure. One of my favorite things about getting on a Peloton is that you can choose which country and city you're going to ride in. So you can go through their library and find all different sort of classes that you can take with different instructors or you can take a ride in Annessy France like I did this morning when I was on my way to work. Well, I wasn't on my way to work because I was on a Peloton. But if I had been on a rail bike, I would have made it to work because that's how long I ride. Peloton is more than just a bike company. They actually make a treadmill and a row or two. So, you can discover a whole new world of exciting classes that change working out from another dreaded task to something you want to stick with. Learn from the best. No matter where you're starting from, Peloton's expert instructors are there to guide you with contagious energy and supportive instruction at every level to really take the guesswork out of working out. Try Peloton tread, row, or bikes risk-free with a 30-day home trial. New members only, not available in remote locations, see additional terms at 1peloton.com slash home dash trial. 1peloton.com slash home dash trial. This show was sponsored by BetterHelp. I remember when I went to therapy and I learned about self awareness for the first time, that was a real eye-opener and really kind of helped me through the rest of my life. Now that I know how I come across, it changed the way that I tell people information that I want to relate to them. So, getting to know yourself can be a lifelong process, especially because we are always growing and we are always changing. Therapy is all about deepening your self-awareness and understanding because sometimes we don't know what we want or why we react the way we do until we talk through things. BetterHelp connects you with a licensed therapist who can take you on that journey of self-discovery from wherever you are. If you're thinking of starting therapy, give BetterHelp a try. Discover your potential with BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com slash dear Chelsea today to get 10% off your first month. That's betterhelp hglp.com slash dear Chelsea. Picture Miami. Picture its beaches. Picture the palm trees. Swearing in the wind. Picture three radio journalists. Assassinated in cold blood. This is silenced. The radio murders. They left the body there for a reason. It was the calling card. It's like the mafia used to do. And yet, the mastermind has never been caught. To find him, we had to go deep into a world of drugs and darkness. And then there were these hints of a much bigger conspiracy. This year I clearly gave a green light. I'm Osvallocian. Listen to silence, the radio murders. On the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts. Or wherever you get your podcasts. I want to know how it made you feel to get all this love online. Oh my god. And I mean, you're a viral superstar on Instagram and TikTok. If you don't follow her already, it's at Dylan Mulvaney. And hey, you're killing it on TikTok right now too. I'm digging the PSA. I got another one coming up that involves you. So tell us about what that welcoming and affirmation must feel like because after going through something and experiencing something for so long and taking the bull by a torrents and saying, fuck it, this is my life. I'm going to do what I'm going to do. And having people applaud that. Well, I still don't really get social media, to be honest. It's so crazy how fast things can travel there. And I think normally, I was a musical theater kid. I still want to be an actress. And normally you book a movie and you have two years before it comes out. So you have some preparation of, OK, this might happen. But I think I had a million followers in like 17 days and no one can really like get you ready for that. And I think also, I was essentially sharing the most vulnerable parts of my life. So there's kind of a double whammy of putting yourself out there and having your transness on display. And if there was, if another trans person came to me right now and said, Oh, should I start from day one and showcase? I'd say, Oh, babe, I don't know about that just because of all of the turmoil that's come from it. But I will say the amount of love and the fact that on day one, I said, this is who I am. And I hadn't had, you know, any surgery, I was still very much finding my femininity and figuring out what really makes me a woman versus the misogyny that I still am working through that was placed on me. But I was supported by women saying, we stand by you, we see you as a woman, we're here for you on this journey. And now I have people in the comments being like, we've been here since day one, day seven, day nine. And that gives me hope. And I hope that it shows other trans people that are still in the closet that they can when they're ready and on their own time, that they can feel allowed to come out and to experience life in a beautiful way. Yeah, I think one of the most offensive things to hear is people who are talking about, you know, trans people saying, Oh, it's trendy. It's trendy. Are we supposed to let children change their sex before they're ready? Because what if they change their mind back? And I, it's such a miseducation and an unknowing, like I had a friend say to me, Oh, I know there are eight year old kids that are getting transgender surgery without their parents. And I'm like, that's simply not true. First of all, there is no eight year old that can go to the fucking doctor and become drive themselves there. It's just so dumb. But it's it's insane that that notion of like trendiness because transness has existed, like since the beginning of time, and truly like in certain cultures, the two spirits or transness was actually like seen as almost the most holy or the most reverent or the most respected. And it's so sad to watch as you know, the years go by, it get sort of picked apart due to capitalism and and all of these things that have essentially let go of the fact that this is who we are. And then also just in a scientific aspect from a scientific perspective, there is a spectrum of male, what male, like Arnold Schwarzenegger is at one end of the spectrum. Yeah. Okay. And then Pamela Anderson is at the other end of the spectrum. That's a boy. That's a girl. And then there's 50 million things in between. Yes. Yes. So it's biological as well. It's not just an idea. This has been going on since people were born. Like there's this is not new. This is not trendy. We just happen to have a vocabulary about it in this modern era. It makes me very sad to when they go, oh, she's doing this to be to get famous or you know what? When I came out, I was assumed that I would not work for a very long time. I, you know, it's not like trans people are out here, you know, thriving. We're just trying to survive. And I am my experience online that you know, in my success is like one one millionth of what it actually is to be trans. The transphobia I experience is so different than that of a black trans woman who you know, these are as much as I am going through it and I have, you know, a lot of people that maybe don't care for me. There's still so much privilege in what I'm in my experience compared to other trans peoples. And I need to make sure that we're taking care of the whole community and that this isn't, you know, some, there's nothing about this that's a gimmick. This is my truth. It's such an odd remark to make that they think that I would do this for any reason, but because of it's such a difficult decision. Yeah. Well, and there is, they think there is something scary to people who are scared of, of transness or, you know, the LGBTQ community. There's something scary about someone like you who chooses despite that adversity to show up bubbling over with joy and to bring positivity. And even though it is difficult to still show off your joy. Well, and that's the thing I, I, and I'll say also, and you, I think you'll get me on this, comedy for me is my way in. And so a lot of the times I will make light of sometimes these really dark situations because it's my coping mechanism. It always has been, I like making people laugh. I like making people smile. I was doing a lot of stand up about a year ago. And I realized it was, it was very healing for me to I love to overshare. I think you can relate. But I tried to find the funny and transness and it's really, it's a slippery slope because then things get taken out of context or it gets used against you. And I think I now am trying to take a step back in, in another thing that happens to, and your trans is you immediately get labeled as like an activist and that you know how to speak on all of these things and that you have the answers. But I'm a baby trans. You know, I'm still so new to my journey that I've made a lot of missteps. I've spoken out of turn. And the, the most important thing is that, you know, hopefully not all trans people have to be these like activists have to have every single answer. You know, I have so much left to learn. That's a good point that you bring up as an activist. Also, you're speaking up for things that you care about. It doesn't mean that you know the answer to every in and out of this, the subject or the topic. Obviously, we are interested in educating ourselves on whatever, whatever topic we're being an ally to or an ally for or well, that's, you know, I'm a musical theater major. So I mean, that's my way in and like, God, can I sing about it? Can I do? And that's what I did on day 365. I was like, Oh, let me show people what I actually want to do, which was perform. And I used my story to kind of put it into a show. And now going forward, I think that if I was to create a show with the trans character or to write the touring show, those are different forms of activism in itself. And I actually think that through scripted and through comedy that we can learn from from from from. Absolutely. I mean, that's how we learn about everything in this world. Right. It's almost easier when it's not a real human that it's like, Oh, there, there's a little bit of mystery there. Yeah, absolutely. I wonder if for folks who aren't really clear about euphoria and dysphoria, can you talk to us a little bit about that? Okay. So I remember like early on in my transition, like those first moments of actually purchasing an item of clothing that I've always, you know, craved wearing or even just like a man opening the door and calling me ma'am. I know that that's so gender stereotype, but it was like, Oh my God, like it and funny enough during the pandemic wearing those masks, it was kind of nice because I still have a little, you know, I'm trying to get rid of this beard hair and she's really putting up a fight. But Hey, by the way, I'm trying to deal with my beard hair too. You know, that's what I heard. I have those blonde while I have different hair hair, but the blonde fuzzies I think come through, the time they come through, we'll do it together. And I, I just think they're euphoria truly are those little moments that sometimes it isn't this like outward like, Oh my God, it's that, but it's like that little spark in you that's like, Oh, yes. And then dysphoria is truly, it feels like a darkness that kind of washes over you. And it is those moments of being misgendered. Or I remember before transitioning, having to put on a male outfit for an audition or, you know, just like that conforming that made me so sad. Yeah. And that's what I think a lot of these haters don't realize is that the the mental effects of, of misgendering in the media, it breaks my heart because, you know, there are people calling me a man and I don't, right now, I feel like I'm not even processing any of it because I, I'm so scared to, to do that deep dive and to know what the effects are. And I'll say these haters, they really wore me down for a second. But then they came for you Chelsea. And I thought, Oh my God, this is my favorite woman in the entire world. And the same people that are coming for me are coming for her. And it actually something clicked. And I went, Oh my God, maybe what they're saying isn't true because I'm now watching them take out someone I love. And I know her truth and I stand by her and I love her. So maybe the same goes for me because it's almost easier when it's not about you and it's about someone you love or enjoy. And I know we hadn't met yet, but I actually was able to see in through your experience with them. Oh, wow. I love that. Yeah. I mean, I was saying this to you a little bit before we started, but, you know, the haters is kind of like, it's just like you have a big pile of stuff. There's always going to be there's going to be some negative stuff. You know, you have to learn how to focus on the positive and all the people that you're impacting. And eventually, it just rolls right off your back. And we both know how to have a good time. Exactly. And that's what, you know, I don't think they want to see that. No, no, no, no. I mean, for Republican men to tell me that I'm unhappy, I'm like, who said I was happy? You guys are assuming I'm happy because of the way I'm living. Yeah, I'm not going, I'm happy. I'm happy. I don't have to say that because I fucking am happy. I don't have to scream it from the rooftops. Amen. Every time I do now, something they've given me more motivation just to fuck with them because they can't handle a woman who knows, a that can take care of a lot of people around her that doesn't need a man to do that and doesn't need a child to do that. You're not going to keep me down ever. And I think that's how anyone who's ever receiving that has to look at it. It's like, look at the source. You know what I mean? Look at the ignorance and look at the idea for me personally, the idea that a man knows what's best for me is preposterous, especially a man that doesn't actually know you. No, but no one who knows me knows what's best for me, except for me. You and my sister may be Simone and Shoshana, but I don't even know. I know what's best for me. Yeah. You know what I mean? Just like you know what's best for you. And like every individual listening to this podcast knows what's best for you. There's an inner knowing that we all have and it doesn't matter if you were born a boy or born a girl, you have an intuition that comes with your person. And that's what you have to listen to. And on that note, we should take some callers. Yeah. We're going to take a break so I can calm the fuck down. Okay. Picture Miami. Picture its beaches. Picture the palm trees. Swaying in the wind. Picture three radio journalists. Assassinated in cold blood. This is silenced. The radio murders. They left the body there for a reason. It was the calling card. It's like the mafia used to do. And yet, the mastermind has never been caught. To find him, we had to go deep into a world of drugs and darkness. And then there were these hints of a much bigger conspiracy. This year I clearly gave a green light. I'm Osvylosian. Listen to silence. The radio murders. On the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. For couch softeners on tag, I'm designer outlet no monsda. I'm zipping my avatine de spous de i sépots and ex-rabbat often outlet price, but you are in on that I sépts designer Martin. Decent on tag funds were perceived in all. In designer outlet no monsda. Outlet price and ever so zipped reports and goods to guys who for pay. Hi, I'm Skylar Baylor and I want to tell you about my new podcast, Dear Skylar. I was the first transgender athlete to compete in any sport on an NCAA Division I men's team. I've shared my story on 60 Minutes on the Ellen Show, but this podcast isn't just about me. Whenever I run a seminar or speak at an event when I'm talking to a client or running a support group, I try to answer as many questions as possible. And believe me, I get a lot of them. That's why on this show on Dear Skylar, every episode revolves around giving an answer to common questions that I'm asked. I talk to all kinds of incredible guests and friends from the world of sports, entertainment, politics, law, science, people whose lived experiences, expertise and wisdom can help you, and me gain insight into how to answer these questions. Dear Skylar is not a place for hot takes or tearing people down or canceling anyone. On Dear Skylar, I want people to ask those questions they don't know how to ask, that they don't have the right words or language for so we can actually dissect the question and answer it. Listen to Dear Skylar on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, and everywhere you listen to podcasts. And we're back. We're back. We're still in Chelsea. Well, our first question is just an email. Kayla says, Dear Chelsea, rejection has always been my biggest fear. As a kid, I had almost no friends. I was teased for my looks. My old soul personality was misunderstood. Now I'm in my mid thirties and I have more friends than I can handle. Don't get me wrong. I feel grateful to have so many girlfriends that I can count on and grow with, but I feel pretty overwhelmed with maintaining all of these relationships in a meaningful way. Nowadays, I seem to mostly get asked to go to all the big events such as weddings, birthdays and baby showers, and I'm often told you're the busiest person I know, so I'm less likely to get asked to just have coffee. It's true though, my schedule feels so full and I'm drained by balancing all these relationships. Besides friends, my husband has a large family and mine is quite sizable too. It's a lot of personal relationships to maintain. Chelsea, you seem like the kind of person who has a ton of friends. How do you keep up with everyone? I never feel like I'm being a good enough friend. Should I try to not be so hard on myself or work on more practical ways to keep in touch with them all? Thanks so much, Kayla. Oh, well, that's a good problem to have. I would say I'll go first and then Dylan, you can chime in anytime you want. Okay. I would say that yes, that is a good problem to have. I would say to be respectful to all of the people that are in your life. And the way I show respect personally is I respond to every text and email that I get. I always respond. It might take a minute, but especially text, I find that that is a more personal kind of way. So if I've forgotten an email or two, that's probably true. But texting wise, I try to get back to every single person who leaves me a text message. And even if it's the news isn't good, like, I can't make it, it's nice to just show that kind of, they used to say deference in school. When I wouldn't respect my teachers, they said you had to show deference. And I was like, fuck off. But deference is just showing somebody respect and saying like, you know, creating boundaries creates respect. That is true. When you say no to things because you need time alone or you know, you have other plans or whatever, that's all fine. You don't have to overextend yourself. That's not doing anybody any favors because you grow resentful of the person that you're overextending yourself for and you grow resentful of not spending enough time on yourself. So I would just say to anybody, like, I mean, it seems like it seems like it's more of a personal problem from your writing. Like, you feel that you need to spend all this time with all these people. I would say dial that back a little bit, give yourself some room to breathe and reassess yourself, give yourself six weeks and say, okay, I'm going to do this for six weeks and see how I feel at the end of the six weeks. I'm going to respond to anyone who asks me, but I'm not going to make plans with every single person who asks me. I'm going to say actually, I have a really busy week or if you're not, I mean, it was kind of a mixed message because she's saying she's getting invited to big things rather than the little things. If those little interactions are important for you and studies show that it is very important to socialize, it isn't very important to be around other people. But it's also very important to regroup. Like, I need an inordinate amount of time to be by myself in order for me to perform on stage on a regular basis during a tour. I need to be alone for many hours a day. I have to conserve my fucking energy because I don't have the energy and the stamina that I had when I was in my 20s and, you know, whatever. So I have. Because you're so present with people. And that's what I'll say. I nearly died when you said I respond to every text message because my phone is like, we're in the hundreds, babe. And I was feeling so guilty. I'm the number one people pleaser. But then I realized my goal is that when I actually am with someone in person or if I'm on a phone call, I'm going to be a hundred percent present. And I'm not, I don't want to do the half ass sort of like, oh, I'm going to hang out with a bunch of people, but I'm going to be, you know, in a bunch of different places in my head or working or no, I want to show up. And when I do get those moments, which maybe are more rare now with with friends or loved ones, I want to be there fully. And I've actually now set the precedent that, do you know, Glenn and Doyle? Yeah, she talked about she doesn't really text anymore. She thinks that it's you're basically always at the beck and call of someone else. And so now all my friends know to call me and we'll have these great, you know, phone calls and chats and and that has like filled me up in a new way. And you know what, that's great that you say that because I'm the opposite. I would prefer a text rather than a phone call. Don't fucking call me. But, but I think what you said is very prescient because it's, it's very important. That's what I said to my girlfriend once she got mad at me for canceling. And I said, listen, I can't, I'm canceling because I'm not going to be able to be present. I'm exhausted. I'm tired. I feel like shit. I want to be present. And that is the most important gift you can give somebody is your time and presence. And how funny to the people that I want to hang out with the most are usually the ones that are like, Oh, I'm not going to message her because she's busy, but then it's the people that, you know, they're all they're howling to you to hang out and you're like, wait, no, I want to go see these other people. Yeah, yeah. So I think it's also really reaching out to the people that you want to be around that you want to go on that coffee date with and then saying no when it when it feels right. And also measuring how you feel after your interactions with people like actually taking in, are you getting a lot out of this relationship? Or are you being present for someone going through a difficult time? Those are two ends of the spectrum, but they also like, I like to be there. I like emotional triage when somebody needs something and a friend needs something, then I like to be there for them. I excel at that. But I'm not going to be doing that for two years in a row. You know what I mean? I want to help you get out of it. And then there's other friends who don't necessarily need you who are bringing something and filling your cup up. So it's good to measure the time that you're spending with people because if you're exhausting yourself on three people that are fair weather friends, and then you're then you've lost all your energy for the real friend, like you have to kind of measure who brings what into your life and what is the value and how much of a priority each friend is. Communicating with someone how you like to be communicated with what you've both said I think is awesome. So for example, maybe it's sorry I can't come to your birthday party, but let's grab coffee and set a date. You know, so that you've got that one on one time with someone who does fill your cup. Yeah, that's nice. Because you like to text it. I like to call. So I just have to mark a below. We'll meet each other in the middle. Do you call or do you FaceTime? Oh, I like to call because I like what if I'm peeing or you know, I don't. That's a lot. Face timing is a lot. Right. Well, FaceTiming is a lot. I consider that to be an assault. You know what I mean? Like you can't just fucking FaceTime me, but most of my people know that. Nobody does that. Talking on the phone I have to say is sexier than FaceTiming. It's a little mystery. Yes. Like, staring at somebody for two hours. It's just not a phone. There's like a, you know, a man that you're texting and all of a sudden it goes beep, beep, beep, beep, and you're like, oh, shit. You know, and you're like putting on some eyeliner really fast. See how long you're like one minute throw your phone in the toilet. Oh my God. Well, Kayla, let us know how it goes. Yeah, Kelly, hopefully we gave you some advice. Yeah. Yeah. Well, our first caller today is Dane. And this one is a bit of a gut punch. So fair warning. Okay. Dear Chelsea, I'm writing in today because I'm a trans guy and my mom has been ashamed of me ever since I came out as trans to her almost a decade ago. She didn't understand then and still doesn't. We didn't speak for almost nine months because she didn't respect my name change and my pronouns. When I would tell her it hurt my feelings that she didn't even try to use my preferred name or pronouns. She'd lecture me for hours about how selfish I was or I needed to grow up and understand that the real world would never be as understanding as she was. She's a proud conservative and conspiracy theorist and takes every opportunity to spread her ignorance. I'm at my wit's end. She's currently engaged to a guy who's even more transphobic than she is. He supposedly loves me, but here's the thing. He doesn't know I'm trans. If he knew, I think he'd lose it. He saw a picture of me pre transition early in their relationship and asked her about it. Instead of the truth, she told him that she had a daughter who was killed in a drug driving accident. When I had top surgery several years ago, she made up excuses and lied to him about why she was coming over to check on me. She's my only remaining family. I've always taken care of her since I was a young child. I was the parent for both of us. She sees me as her son now but still posts transphobic things online constantly. She isn't supportive of my long-term transition goals and if I so much as cough, she blames it on my hormone therapy. As I get older and work through all my trauma and therapy, I'm starting to wonder how much I should keep trying with her. I don't want to lose my only family, but I also feel so jaded from everything she's put me through. What should I do? Dane. Hi, Dane. Dane. Hi. Oh my god. This is Dylan Mulvaney. She's our guest today. So you have another set of years. Nice to meet you. First of all, I just want to, I wish I could give you the biggest hug ever. I'm trans as well and I know that our journeys are very different, but I can relate on multiple levels. I come from a very conservative family as well and I know how frustrating this might be. But I do believe people are capable of change and sometimes it can take a long time, but I also, what I worry about with your mom is it sounds like she loves you with almost like an asterisk of what that means. There's all of these layers of getting to that love that should just be so pure between a parent and a child with no, what's the word? Unconditional. It should be unconditional love, but between a mother and a child or between hopefully any two people. But unfortunately, that's not the world we live in, but continue. I'm just hoping that outside of this one person that is technically your biological family, I just want you to have the most amazing chosen family around you. And I want you to be surrounded with other trans people that love you and making sure that when those transphobic comments do come from someone like your mom, that they can be there to step up and say, that's not true. We know you and this is what we see. And I just, I don't want you to lose your favorite parts of yourself because of that bond that you're trying so hard to keep together. Do you have any thoughts, Chels? Yeah, I would say that your mom is really toxic for you at this stage in your life. I also believe people change, but her behavior posting anti-trans shit online when she knows that she has a son whose trans is just that's like hanging out with your own bully. You know what I mean? I don't think that there's any benefit or change that's going to happen from continuing this relationship, especially after the circumstances you mentioned in this letter, your stepfather who she lied to about her son. I mean, what is that? That's crazy. I mean, that's very psychotic behavior. And you can't pretend somebody died. That's psychotic. So, I think based on her behavior alone, I think you kind of owe it to yourself to create a lot of distance and enjoy the people that you have in your life that really love you. I know this is your mother and then that's very difficult. I've never had to disassociate from my parents, but I would say that it's not in your best interest to have her in your life. Yeah. Yeah. We've had periods in our relationship where we have gone months at a time without speaking. And because of all the trauma that we've been through individually and together, we always kind of end up coming back together. And that in itself is really hard. You know, that what kind of trauma are you talking about? Are you talking about your transition or are you talking about other trauma? Other trauma. Okay. Like what? Really bad stuff. You know, that she's done and that was done to both of us throughout my childhood and her childhood. I say, you know, it's brutal. Trauma bonding is a real thing. And especially when we're all each other has, it makes it extra hard, you know, to kind of separate those ties. And it makes it hard to when there is that distance and that separation, then promises are made that, oh, yeah, we'll try. We want, you know, we won't talk about these things or we won't do this. And then those promises fade away and old habits come out. And then it's just like, oh, you haven't really changed. You're still the same toxic person. And you just kind of wanted to Trojan horse your way back in. So it's hard. And I do believe people can change. You know, I'm evidence of that. You know, I've changed a lot and I've grown and healed in a lot of really positive ways. You're amazing. Thank you. But it's hard to want the same thing for her, you know, to want her to heal and for her to grow in positive ways, but to not be able to force that and just to kind of have to bear the burden of that trauma in that way and not walk together in the light. You know what I mean? Yeah, you said that you ended up taking care of her. And I want you to know that that was not your job and that a child is should be a child and a parent should be the parent. And that those roles that were placed on you are not normal. That wasn't healthy. And they've continued throughout your life, even though you're now also an adult. And I believe that your trans ness was probably one of the first times that you went against taking care of her because you that was that was you taking care of yourself. And that scared the shit out of her. And that trans phobia, it could have been anything, but it was your transness that took precedent because that's who you are. That was always who you've been. And I think for her that that resentment towards your transness also comes from the fact that you were able to stand up to her and say, this is who I am. I'm playing by these rules. And that's kind of one of the only times that you've you've done that because it was so important to you. But you need to be able to do that in every area of your life and not just your gender identity, because that is when she will actually see you as an equal and as an adult and someone that you know, it's kind of sounds like maybe you should go cold turkey for a second and show her what it's like to experience her life without you because you bring so much light to it that maybe she needs to be reminded just exactly how much light that is. If you do choose to keep a relationship with her at all, you got to unfollow the Facebook, you got to unfollow all the socials, mute, whatever you got to do, but like you don't need to see that you don't need that popping up in your day and give yourself boundaries as well because I know you live in different places. When you do go to visit, don't stay at her house. You need to stay nearby somewhere else so that when you need to retreat and go into your own space, you have the opportunity to do that. Yeah, and creating boundaries. You need to create boundaries. Also, the fact that she has not told her husband that you're trans, that is like such a huge red flag of shame. And you, there is nothing to be ashamed of of being you. And I breaks my heart that she is so scared to even share that with another very important person in her life. And so I think before that reunion can happen, I think that conversation needs to happen. And it might prolong that time apart and it might get even messier, but I don't think you can go forward in this relationship with that secret. And my God, like you're her child at the end of the day, that should take the cake. I have a question. Have you had any separation from her? Like, have you guys ever taken a time out from your relationship? Yeah, like we've had periods of up to like almost a year of not speaking, not seeing each other at all. And then you kind of just revert back to where it started or back to your regular habits with each other? You know, over time, it doesn't just go immediately back to like over super, you know, super close, take some time and get back there. But yeah, eventually we end up back, you know, two peas in a pod kind of thing. We've never gotten like fully, you know, back to where we were like when we were when I was a kid, but. See, you just almost said when we were kids, that's how you think of her as a kid, you know, because that's how she is behaving probably and how you guys travel and bought it in the first place because you were both in a situation where you felt like you were being treated like children or you were acting like children when you were a child and she wasn't. So trauma bonding is very, very complicated. And you do you have a therapist that you see? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, I, you think I'm surviving without a therapist? Yeah. Do you have other trans people in your life that are like lifting you up? Not closely. You know, I'm part of a few online groups that I reach out to occasionally for support for my transition goals, but I'm not like close with any trans people. Really? Well, I'll be close to you. Three is by all means. I would love that because it's it's hard. Yeah. It is hard. Where are you? Where do you live? I'm in the Portland area. Okay. I was going to say we should get you connected with Shane from season one. Oh, yes. Yes. Oh my God. Prison is not a joke, right? Yeah. We'll follow each other. Yeah. We have to connect you with Shane too. He transitions as well and and didn't tell his family for like eight years. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. So that's the way to do it. Yeah. I think that's that's a very good goal for you also is to have a little bit more of a community for you. You know, take Dylan up on her offering and you guys can connect online and also will connect you with Shane. But yeah, I think you need a timeout from your mom. And I think before you reintroduce her back into your life, then you're going to have to really set some clear boundaries for your own mental health. You know, don't follow her. You don't need to be exposed to any of that. What Catherine said, but also for her to be able to be in your life, she has to meet certain requirements and that that's up to you what those have to be. But I would suggest that one of them should be truthful to the person that she's marrying about the truth of your situation. Because any secret builds shame and it's unnecessary. Yeah, actually, you know, I finished reading this book, Healing the Shame that Binds You by John Bradshaw. And I really, I loved it. But I even won that huge like reading cake lately. And I really enjoyed that book because it's all about toxic shame. And I sent it to my mom. I was like, you should really read this. And she's like, Oh, yeah, I'll check it out. I don't know that she actually will. But if she does, maybe it'll teach her a few helpful lessons. Hey, you gave her a resource and now it's a two way street and she can meet you halfway. It's the least she could do. We'll see. Yeah. And then how does it feel to you when we say to take a break from your mother? How does that make you feel? I mean, it's something that I've done before and something that I'm fully aware is logical and reasonable and something that is good for me while it counts. And will you let her know you're taking a break or you'll just phase out? It'll probably just phase out. I mean, she already senses distance between us, you know, like she and that'll make her even try to cling harder because she still randomly guilt me about certain things when she senses that distance. Like, I know I haven't been the best mother. And you know, but you turned out so great despite me, that kind of thing. Actions speak louder than words. So yeah, 100%. I think it would benefit. I'm always into writing a letter like even if it's a goodbye letter, it's nice to write it, whether you send it or not is up to you. And maybe this is something you can discuss further with your therapist. But you should write a letter about how it feels for your mother to deny who you are. Oh, I got you beat on that. I don't mean to interrupt you, but I have sent her like an hour long video. This is the last time we didn't speak for like six months. Oh, really? Like, yeah, an hour long video like, this is all the abuse that you put me through. I'm tired of you like hating on me and other trans people, you know, minorities and like all this shit that you post online, I'm sick of it. It was literally like an hour long video. And her response to me was just, I'm so tired of you hating on me just because of my political views. I've walked on eggshells around you for the last five years. You know, it's not, I think we just need a break from each other is basically what she said. Political views. Yeah, it's like, it's called human rights. Totally disregard everything I said about, you know, the abuse and the way she treats me and me being trans, she just disregard all that. I'm just like, sorry, my politics to send you. Let's take a break from each other. Yeah, well, maybe it's not so accusatory or maybe it's not such an indictment of her. Maybe you can make it short and sweet and put it in writing. So it's not even you speaking. So she can't be misinterpreted. Just saying how much I love you, hear my mother, you know, you gave birth to me. We've been through a lot together. And now I have to get healthy. And I can't do that. And when my true personhood is being denied by the person who gave birth to me and make it so simple and not make it about you did this, you did this, you did this, it's about how you feel and why you have to move on. And of course she may not accept that or think it's garbage or dismiss it. But it's a nice way of ending or putting like a pin in something without having anything left unsaid or unspoken. It's not mandatory. But if you feel like doing something like that and writing something short and sweet, that isn't nasty or harmful, but it's about you and your growth. It might be something that sits better with her because she's obviously on the defense all the time. Maybe it could be like what you would love to have in a mom and in not how she's not those things. But like, I think now it's you aren't a child anymore. And so you get to redefine this relationship of what does a parent mean to you now? And these are the things that, you know, is it I need a cheerleader? I need someone who's we call each other every week just to check in or, you know, getting very specific about like what that relationship that you want to look like. And that could be far away. But I just I really feel for you. I personally have actually been through something a little similar as recently. I want to tell you that it's going to be okay. And I'm just I want you to have all the trans people in your life. I think trans masculine people also to make sure that you feel so supported, that you know your magic and that you are so loved. Thank you. I really appreciate that. Yeah, you are loved. So like, know that you what you did is really, really brave, like you're a brave person. And you don't have to subject yourself to people that make you feel less than it's just not your responsibility. You're not responsible for your mother. You're not responsible for anything but your own decency and like humanness. You know what I mean? And as long as you're following your gut and you're following your instinct and you're being good to people around you and being loving and caring of others, you there's nothing wrong with that. That's a beautiful, beautiful thing. And the road that you got here, like it sounds like you've been through a lot of trauma. You don't deserve any more trauma. Yeah, I definitely don't want anymore. It's like that. Yeah. Well, Dane, thank you so much for sharing with us. I know this is really, really tough stuff. Yeah, we're sending you a lot of love, honey, Benny. Yeah, when I was writing into you guys, I was just thinking of the Martha Stewart episode where she's like, Chelsea, you get some really heavy shit on here. Yeah, meanwhile, Martha was not fucking ready for that. I was like, all right, Martha, this might not be the right person to have got people calling in since she can't relate to anybody normal. And she listens to this. She's like, ah, she won't be listening to this. I promise you. She's baking. Yeah, yeah, she's baked. Yeah, she's baked. Yeah, she's baked. Oh, poor Martha. Okay, well, Dane, keep in touch with us. Okay. If you need anything ever again, let us know. Thank you guys so much. Take care. Okay. Bye. The idea of all these people, these parents, I don't understand how parents can disown their own child. I, as a non-parent, wouldn't be able to disown a human being that came to me and said, I'm different than what we thought, you know, like, I, or whatever. Yeah. Like, it doesn't even have to be related to me. So I don't understand this, like, I guess I'm just in a bubble. I am in a bubble. Picture Miami. Picture its beaches. Picture the palm trees swaying in the wind. Picture three radio journalists assassinated in cold blood. This is silenced. The radio murders. They left the body there for a reason. It was the calling card. It's like the mafia used to do. And yet, the mastermind has never been caught. To find him, we had to go deep into a world of drugs and darkness. And then there were these hints of a much bigger conspiracy. This is clearly given green light. I'm Osvallocian. Listen to silence, the radio murders, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Skylar Baylor and I want to tell you about my new podcast, Dear Skylar. I was the first transgender athlete to compete in any sport on an NCAA Division I men's team. I've shared my story on 60 Minutes on The Ellen Show, but this podcast isn't just about me. Whenever I run a seminar or speak at an event when I'm talking to a client or running a support group, I try to answer as many questions as possible. And believe me, I get a lot of them. That's why on this show, on Dear Skylar, every episode revolves around giving an answer to common questions that I'm asked. I talk to all kinds of incredible guests and friends from the world of sports, entertainment, politics, law, science, people whose lived experiences, expertise, and wisdom can help you, and me gain insight into how to answer these questions. Dear Skylar is not a place for hot takes or tearing people down or canceling anyone. On Dear Skylar, I want people to ask those questions they don't know how to ask, that they don't have the right words or language for, so we can actually dissect the question and answer it. Listen to Dear Skylar on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, and everywhere you listen to podcasts. Badass of the week, hosted by me, Ben Thompson, and my co-host, Dr. Pat Larrish. That's me. Is an exciting new podcast from iHeartRadio that dives into stories full of guts, glory, and everything in between. And every week, we're telling stories of the most badass figures in history, mythology, and even fiction. We're talking about ninjas, Vikings, pirates, explorers, and scientists, and even the occasional awesome dog. You mean like goofy? Is goofy a dog or is Pluto the dog? Anyway, no. I'm not talking about goofy. I'm talking about Sergeant Stubby. I'm talking about war hero dogs. I'm talking about a bear named Wojtek that carried artillery shells for the Polish artillery during World War II. I might bring up Las Carina Bovolina. She's an 18th century Greek naval commander and freedom fighter. Or maybe Gal Varena, the indigenous Mapuche warrior who replaced his severed hands with swords to fight the conquistadors. Yeah, this is the show. Listen to Badass of the week on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Well, we have one last caller and I thought this was a good question because it sort of has less to do with actually dating and more to do with how other people perceive us as we move through the world after talking to her. But Marie says, dear Chelsea, I'm a 31 year old woman currently living in North Carolina. I realized in my late 20s that I was not attracted to men after years of suppressing my attraction to women. I've been on several dates with women who I feel attracted to. The dates have gone well. When I ask that person out again, I'm always hit with, oh, well, I'm not looking to date anyone currently or I just didn't feel anything romantic with you. If this happened once or twice, I'd be able to brush it off. However, this has happened after every single date I've had or every connection I make on dating apps. I appreciate the honesty from these women and I appreciate their communication versus being ghosted, but I feel like maybe I'm undatable. Do you have any advice for me or other people currently struggling with the challenges of dating in the modern world? Marie. Hi Marie. Hi Marie. Hi, Chelsea. Hi. Hi. How are you? I'm doing well. How are you doing? We're good. This is Dylan Milvaney. She's our special guest today. So say hello to Dylan. Hi Dylan. Nice to meet you Marie. I meet you. So just to rewind, just to recap, you said, as you started becoming interested in women, it's been more difficult to date. Yeah. So I was definitely struggling with figuring out who I was attracted to because I was dating men at the time. And I just absolutely was not attracted to them going out on these dates. So I started talking to a few friends and one of my friends had suggested, maybe you're actually attracted to women. You should try dating some women. Just trying to figure out who you are. Of course, it was also COVID lockdowns and then with the challenges of working a pretty busy job and then starting school, I just wasn't really focused on my dating life until probably around the end of 2022. And then starting 2023 is when I really kind of started seriously getting back into the dating game. With the past couple of dates I've went on. I felt like the connection was really great through text messaging. I thought the dates were going really well. We had a lot of good chemistry. But afterwards, when I'd go to ask these women out again, I'd be told like, hey, I'm not really feeling a connection here. Hey, I'm not really thinking about dating at this time. And I'm not sure if I'm doing something unintentionally or subconsciously where I'm putting off a vibe of like, hey, maybe I'm not interested in this person or anything like that. I'm just not sure if I potentially could be doing something that would be causing that. How many dates were you? Did you go on? I've been on three so far. I've asked out probably a total of five people. True, the people I've asked out, they told me like, hey, I'm not looking to date right now or hey, I'm sorry, I just started in a relationship with somebody else. And then the three actual physical dates I've been on. I've been ghosted by one person and the other person is like, hey, you know, not really feeling a spark here. And then the last one was really the kind of the one that hurt the most because I did feel probably the most chemistry with this individual. The date went really well. And I'm not much of a hugger, but she went to hug me at the end of the night. And I, you know, I hugged her back. And I was really hoping that maybe, you know, she'd want to go out with me again. But I went to ask like a week later and she told me like, hey, you know, sorry, I'm not interested in like dating at this time. Okay. Do you feel like something's happening on these dates? Do you feel like you have a decent sense of self-awareness is the question? Yeah, I do feel like I have a decent sense of self-awareness. I do feel that I'm a pre-confident individual. And I do try to be an active listener when I am going out with these people. So, you know, if they tell me something, asking a follow-up question, you know, related to the conversation we've been having, I'm not sure if there's something subconsciously I could be doing that would be giving off that vibe. But I do feel like I'm pretty self-aware when I am on these dates. Okay. Well, what I would say is first of all, you shouldn't relax your attitude about the whole thing. Okay. Because life is about rejection. You're going to get rejected a ton of times. It's going to happen again. It's going to keep happening. You know what I mean? And then there are going to be people in between that you're going to date and that you're going to have and it's going to be mutual. You need to look at this, just kind of change your perspective, I think will change the outcome a lot. I think you should look at these things as more casual and be a little bit lighter if you can figure out a way to really relax yourself before you go on these dates so that you're not coming off too strong or you're not coming off too rigid. I know you said you're not a hugger. That can kind of send out a certain energy when people don't like to be hugged when someone goes in for a hug and that person's not a hugger. You can feel it and that can kind of be a chasm. Do you meditate at all? I started to get into the meditation. I had downloaded the Calm app yesterday and I've been starting to get into that a little bit. Is that what you use, Calm? Well, I was just going to say it's the universe must have been tapping you on the shoulder because that's a good app and I wanted to know what city do you live in? Because I'm available. I'm kidding. The closest big city that I'm located to would be a little. Okay. I was just curious about what the lesbian scene is like out there because my with experience now being around some lesbians out here, they stick together. You know, we travel in packs. Well, I'm I go both ways right now, but I will say that maybe if you can insert yourself into just being friends with some gals who like gals in your area, that way, you know, people can get to know you or these potential women can see you. They can experience you get your personality, get at your quirks. They'll learn that you maybe aren't a hugger but love that about you. And then something could potentially happen more organically, whereas right now, if you're meeting people online, there's this precedent like, Oh, we're here not to be friends. We're here to potentially date. And that's a lot of pressure. Whereas I think in the queer community, so much of it happens in person. It happens at, you know, a gay bar or a bonfire, you know, just that fun, lively queer connection. So I would almost take a detour from the dating and really focus on finding some amazing lesbian friends that can also help guide you to some other people, hopefully nearby. Yeah, I think that's that's really good advice. And making it a numbers game. So going on lots of first dates, think of first dates as just like throw away is a little bit like, think of it as practice like just like, you don't you don't have to look at the date like, okay, I hope this is the one you can look at it as like, what a great way to get to know how to do this better and how to relax yourself. So there's not so much pressure each time you go out. It's almost like, if you overdate for a little bit, you get more comfortable with dating. Yeah, you know, and I know you have a really intense job and she's in the army as well. I was going to say, are you in the military? Yeah, so maybe, you know, not going on a date right after work where you have to bring that intensity, you know, maybe taking some time to breathe, to decompress, listen to some like nice music, move your body a little bit before you go on a date. So you're just like feeling loose and free and like having a good time when you go out. I would say you come across as you have this kind of intense energy, which is a wonderful thing. But now it makes sense, like you do need to decompress, you do need to meditate, you do need to relax so that you can, so you're not bringing your job to your dates with you, right? I'm sure your job is a huge part of your life. But until you get to know somebody, that's not their responsibility. So, you know, you have to just, I think your job from here from this phone call, your takeaway should be ways to really calm yourself so that you're walking into this with an energy of fun, not okay, I'm going to conquer this. You know what I mean? Like, I'm going to get my girlfriend. You should go in it as like experiential, like, okay, this is going to be wonderful. I'm going to learn about this person and then I'm going to learn about this person. And it's not so methodical. It can be a more casual experience. And like what Dylan was saying, do you have a group of friends? Do you have a group of lesbians or any friends that are lesbians? Nobody really close by, but I did join like a meetup group where it was, you know, like a LGBB. Let's go on hikes on the weekend. Activities like that that I was thinking about like meeting up with some of those people on a, you know, weekend hike. I'm obsessed with that. And you already made that initial step. And I'm someone, I'll be honest with you, I haven't even been kissed as a girl yet. And I've never dated anyone seriously. And I just think that we are going to find someone amazing. And it probably might even happen in person, because if these apps don't, I don't feel like they're working for me, it sounds like maybe you're trouble having some trouble to you. Let's get in one of those groups and let's meet some hot people. Yeah, that sounds great. Yeah, it just takes one. My best girlfriend was in a super similar position to you. She had dated guys that wasn't working out. She decided to date women. And she was so intimidated every time she'd go on a date that like she would call it off right afterward. Then she finally met someone she's like, this is going to be nothing. It's just a friend thing. She just came out to we're going to hang out. They made out for four hours and they're still together a year later. So it just takes that one, you know? Yeah, just and treat everything a little bit more lightly. Like you were just smiling. You're beautiful. You have a beautiful smile. Enjoy yourself. It doesn't have to be serious. It can be fun. And so just focus on the aspects of fun and relaxation and being present. And it will be a lot easier for you. You know, you won't feel so rejected when something doesn't work out. There's no reason to feel that way. There's eight billion people in this world. You know, you're not going to hit it off with everybody and have sexual chemistry with everybody. That's kind of a natural selection sort of thing. So just try and take it down a notch in terms of your expectations and being so kind of rigid or regimented about them. Sure, sure. That's all great advice. I really appreciate it from everybody here. And start that calm. You're going to see a difference in your in the way you feel. Five or 10 minutes a day and you'll start to feel differently. I promise that. All right. Sounds good. Well, thank you so much, Marie. Yes, Marie. Let's post it. Good luck. We hope you get some poo-tang soon. Thank you. Bye. Bye. Oh, that was so cute. I immediately when she started talking, I'm like, she the fucking army or what? What? That day? This? And the hair? And the thing. And I'm like, oh my God, when you said that, I was going to say, do you work in the military? Completely. When she first, when we had our pre-interview call, she was in like her military garb and I was like, wow, I'm so afraid and intimidated right now. It was like hot, but intimidated. But also imagine that balance. Like when you're doing that, you're serving in the armed forces, and then you're supposed to have like this casual encounter. It doesn't. You can't approach it the same way at all. Right. No, right. It's a total seesaw. Yeah. So that makes sense anyway. Okay. Well, oh, we're going to wrap up. Exactly. We'll take a break and we're going to wrap up with Dylan Mulvaney. Picture Miami. Picture its beaches. Picture the palm trees. Swearing in the wind. Picture three radio journalists. Assassinated in cold blood. This is silenced. The radio murders. They left the body there for a reason. It was the calling card. It's like the mafia used to do. And yet the mastermind has never been caught. To find him, we had to go deep into a world of drugs and darkness. And then there were these hints of a much bigger conspiracy. I'm Osvylosian. Listen to silence. The radio murders. On the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Skylar Baylor and I want to tell you about my new podcast, Dear Skylar. I was the first transgender athlete to compete in any sport on an NCAA Division I men's team. I've shared my story on 60 Minutes on the Ellen Show, but this podcast isn't just about me. Whenever I run a seminar or speak at an event when I'm talking to a client or running a support group, I try to answer as many questions as possible. And believe me, I get a lot of them. That's why on this show on Dear Skylar, every episode revolves around giving an answer to common questions that I'm asked. I talk to all kinds of incredible guests and friends from the world of sports, entertainment, politics, law, science, people whose lived experiences, expertise and wisdom can help you and me gain insight into how to answer these questions. Dear Skylar is not a place for hot takes or tearing people down or canceling anyone. On Dear Skylar, I want people to ask those questions that they don't know how to ask, that they don't have the right words or language for so we can actually dissect the question and answer it. Listen to Dear Skylar on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, and everywhere you listen to podcasts. Badass of the week, hosted by me, Ben Thompson, and my co-host, Dr. Pat Larrish. That's me. Is an exciting new podcast from iHeart Radio that dives into stories full of guts, glory, and everything in between. And every week, we're telling stories of the most badass figures in history, mythology, and even fiction. We're talking about ninjas, Vikings, pirates, explorers, and scientists, and even the occasional awesome dog. You mean like goofy? Is goofy a dog or is Pluto the dog? Anyway, no. I'm not talking about goofy. I'm talking about Sergeant Stubby. I'm talking about war hero dogs. I'm talking about a bear named Wojtek that carried artillery shells for the Polish artillery during World War II. I might bring up last Sabrina Blubolina as she's an 18th century Greek naval commander and freedom fighter. Or maybe Galvarino, the indigenous Mapuche warrior who replaced his severed hands with swords to fight the conquistadors. Yeah, this is the show. Listen to Badass of the week on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And we're back! We're back! We're back! Just a delight. Just an absolute delight having you here, Dylan. I loved you before I met you and I love you now. And I just can't wait to see what's in store for you. I'm so excited. I do have one question for you before I leave. So we just talked about how Miss Marie there doesn't have anyone. I have yet to be kissed as a girl. I wanted to know, do you think it would be better for me to rip off the band-aid and just get it done or should I save it for someone special? I'm always about ripping off the band-aid. I think I just, you know what it was? I needed to hear it from you. And so tonight I'm gonna hit the town. I love it. I love it. We'll report back. We'll do. Thank you, Dylan. Thank you everybody. See you next week. Love ya. If you'd like advice from Chelsea, shoot us an email at deerchelsiepodcast at gmail.com and be sure to include your phone number. Deer Chelsea is edited and engineered by Brad Dickert, executive producer, Catherine Law. And be sure to check out our merch at ChelseaHannler.com. Picture Miami. Picture its beaches. Picture three radio journalists. Assassinated in cold blood. This is silenced the radio murders. You left the body there for reason. It was the calling card. It's like the mafia used to do. The mastermind has never been caught. To find him, we had to go deep into a world of drugs and darkness. And there were these hints of a much bigger conspiracy. This year I clearly gave with me in life. I'm Osvylosian. Listen to silenced the radio murders on the iHeartRadio app Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. For couch often as on tag in designer outlet moment. I'm zipping my avat and they pursue the I see what's and extra but often outlet price but you are in on a try 60 designer Martin. Decent on tag funds where if proceeds in or in designer outlet moment. Outlet price in my business. I'm Skyler Baylor and I want to tell you about my new podcast Dear Skyler. I was the first transgender athlete to compete in any sport on an NCAA division 1 men's team. I try to answer as many questions as possible. That's why on Dear Skyler every episode revolves around giving an answer to common questions that I'm asked. I talked to all kinds of incredible guests and friends. People whose lived experiences expertise and wisdom can help you and me gain insight into how to answer these questions. Listen to Dear Skyler on the iHeartRadio app Apple Podcasts and everywhere you listen to podcasts.