Sabrina Rudin of Spring Cafe Aspen

Hi, this is Melissa Wood-Teperberg and this is the Move With Heart podcast. Are you ready? Just breathe it all in. I want to talk. I can't lie. I was like, it's going to be short, sweet and very spicy. And we're going to get right into it because apparently something you're going to talk too much. I'm so excited to have you. I'm so excited to be here. We've been talking about this for a while. Yes, and I'm honored that I mean we need to pick your brain. You have so much knowledge. It's just, it's actually insane. You are like my speed dial for so many things. Like if the kids get sick, Sabrina is not a doctor. No. Please take my advice with a grain of salt and do what's best for your family. Yes, of course. But you have a ton of knowledge and I'm so happy that you forced us to be friends. I'm so happy I forced to be friends. I'm also so happy to have a friend that gets into all of this with me because that's part of the joy is like being able to share this with your friends and go back and forth on it and have like wellness sisters for lack of a better term. That's so true. I think like having your people where you, I mean we connect on so many levels, but I want to bring it back because I love the story, how we met. Oh boy. Okay. Well, I didn't mean it. I feel like we should really hear this through your lens because it's very different through mine. Great. Take it away. No, I, we have a mutual friend, Nicole. She had a wonderful blog. She still has it, but she's grown at since Bonbury and she had a feature on you. And you know, like I saw your feature and you had a son who was just about my son's age. They looked alike and here was this beautiful, vibrant young mom with her son that looked like my young son talking about healthy food and nutrition and wellness. And I just thought, Oh my God. I have to be friends with this person. I had such a girl crush on you. And I was like, we're meant to be friends. There's too many weird similarities. You know, you were talking about all the things you feed him and what you do at parties. And then I, it was just about the time when I would think I was starting to think about spring in New York, like years before I actually did it, but just starting to think about it. Right. And a mutual friend a few weeks later, who I brought this up to said, you know, you've got to meet this girl, Melissa with Tepperberg. And I said, that's so crazy. I just saw an article. Who is this person? Yes. Like I want to meet her. So he put us in touch over text. And I'm thinking, you know, this is going to be it. Like this is going to be our moment. And you wanted nothing to do with me. I invited you to lunch. I picked ABC V. I thought, how could she say no, it's vegan. She's vegan. And you said, I don't do one. I'm too busy. I don't do lunch. I've got a really packed schedule for the next like six months. That's where it wasn't that hard. I have the text. And so that was that you made that very clear. And I kept trying to like date you, you know, like I had every few months and be like, Hey, it's Sabrina just checking in. The kids are getting older. It'd be nice to get them together. I was a first time mom. I didn't have many mom friends or Luke. He didn't have many, you know, friends yet. And you wanted nothing to do with it until I kept thinking what really got me was you would sit on your Instagram. And I think this is the part of the story that always cracks you up, but you would be on your Instagram, which I followed. And you'd always go on and say, you know, when you just see someone and you really want to just manifest a friendship and it just happens. And I'd say, hello. I'm here manifesting our friendship, not happening. So then we were at the same mutual friends, baby shower. We were pregnant with our second children. So that's how long you ignored me for. We are now pregnant with our second children. And what do you know, we have the same due date, same due date. That's not like that was a sign for someone who believes in signs. That should have been a sign. That's true. But again, I got really excited and you were like, it's nice. This is not true. And then eventually, I don't know what flipped the switch. I think I just badgered you into submission or friendship. I actually don't even know what it was. I think I truly just wouldn't leave you alone to the point where like I kept checking on you after the baby. I checked on you after you had Eleanor. I think I might have even like sent you something for her. I dropped off a gift and eventually because we had had a few run ins. I think the kids have played in the park. And then that was like, I don't know is that the rest is just. I do really have to say this because it sounds so harsh. And I was saying this the other night at your birthday to your girlfriends who I love. I love all of your friends and I'm obsessed with you and you are truly one of the best additions to my life. I am not easy to become friends with. And this is something I am very aware of and I don't still don't fully like have my finger on it. But I believe it's from growing up and not really trusting. And I think having that like embedded in my soul. Yes, I've grown and I've changed with even like my first girlfriends that I made in New York forced friendship upon me. And it like literally took this strong persistence for me to be like, okay, fine, I'll go. I'll come with you, you know, on a bike ride in Brooklyn. And then I go and I like love it and I connect. And now I see it like I'm able to be like Melissa, just to give it a try, like let people in. I'm I'm no, but I am. I'm very like, I'm very. I'm very open, you go with sisters, you have four sisters and you also have the same best friends that you've had forever. True. Which I think you just like, I think when you have sisters, I was an only child and all I ever wanted was siblings, but mostly I wanted sisters. So I always joke that I had to adopt mine or make mine because there was no other option for me like my parents were one and done. You had sisters, so you had built in friends, whether those relationships are complicated or not. I like really made it my business to go out and make sisters because it's all I ever wanted was this close. Knit group of girlfriends and it took like I was a late bloomer and I didn't have best friends in high school, probably because I was drinking almond milk and carrot juice and it was not hot back then. And even in college, like it was a little touch and go with the things I was cooking in the dorm rooms, but like it's now that you think this is so cool and I'm on a podcast talking about it with my friend, but back then. Right. And it took a while. I really was. I was a late bloomer when it came to meaningful lasting, really wonderful friendships. I mean, you have an incredible group of women in your corner. I mean, I've come to your dinner parties and it's just like I'm like, how do you have this many friends? Well, you're one. I mean, I have a lot of friends, but you have so many friends. I do, but I think I just love gathering people. You do. I love entertaining. I get it from my grandmother. I love cooking. I love hosting. I love, I think a lot of people have a lot of friends, but perhaps are not as committed to gathering them together and being with them so much. I'm really committed to like gathering groups of friends and to being with people. Even my birthday, I thought, Oh, it's 37. I don't need to celebrate this year. I'll just have dinner and then two weeks before my birthday, I said, no, like we have to celebrate. It's my birthday. I really want to be with the people that I love. And so I think it's just that I just like, I like bringing people together. I mean, it's special. I remember you're one of your incredible dinners out East. I like Sabrina didn't tell me how many people were going to be there. And I thought it was like five girls for dinner. I show up and there's so many cars. And I'm like, Oh God, this is like the thought of putting that on. I'm like, this is like my worst. You always say that to me. But I always say you hate like you don't know. I just like that gives me so much anxiety and stress. And I do think growing up with a lot of siblings and also being married to someone who is in hospitality, it's like entertainment is just a part of our lives. But like when we come home, it's not. However, every time I attend and like come to these, I'm like, it's so beautiful and so nice. I just am not so sure I have that in me. Like I don't know. I find it very, I really do. My grandmother was this way. Like she loved entertaining. She loved hosting dinners. She loved hosting lunches. If she had nothing to do that day, she would call a group of friends and just literally create an event, you know, just by having people over. And she would take great pride in signing her table. It was almost like a ritual for her. And I love that. I love entertaining. There's something of course it's stressful in the moment, but that's probably why I have a restaurant. I love, I love gathering and entertaining and I love hosting. So I mean, it is a skill. I don't think it is. I want to hear more about your childhood and your upbringing because if you're drinking almond milk and carrot juice in your dorm room, like I know, I know a lot of where this stems from. If you can share more on your background, like how this was truly like embedded in your soul and has become such a massive part of your life. I mean, my mom and my parents, I didn't, I wish I could say that I sort of had a choice and, you know, came to this on my own, which sure, that's part of the story because I could have gone the complete other way. But I really didn't have a choice in that I wasn't. It wasn't like I was introduced to two paths and this one stuck. It's just how I was raised. My mom in her twenties had terrible allergies, environmental and other allergies and she took years of allergy shots. Nothing worked for her. She got sicker and finally she just started doing her own research, which back then, you know, was much harder to find and obviously not widely accepted or, you know, readily available, but she started finding certain doctors and healers or practitioners. She stumbled upon macrobiotic eating and, you know, raw food diets and cleansing, juicing, things like colonics, you know, all of these things that now are so commonplace and that you talk about. But back when I was a kid, nobody knew what a colonic was or, you know, certainly didn't want to know that your mom was doing that. So she found that way of life completely cured herself of, you know, her severe environmental allergies, food allergies, like was able to live a happier, healthier life after years of trying it another way and met my dad and sort of, I think, introduced him to this way of life. He was older when he met her. So I feel like he, you know, tried other ways of living. He'd gone through his young years and then was ready to, you know, had an open mind and was ready to settle down. And they just, that's how they raised me. They raised me vegetarian. They raised me all organic. I mean, we were, you know, we would do a food co-op once a week and the truck would pull up with big boxes of like the nuts and juices and natural popsicles and organic produce like bok choy and, you know, all of our carrots, veggies, and my mom would go out and we'd pick everything from the truck and I still, like I have vivid because there weren't really many health food stores. I mean, you know, I grew up in the city till I was six and then outside of the city, but when I was really little, there were very few health food stores around, very few restaurants. There wasn't really such a thing as like a juice bar. So my mom was making all of that at home. And I think when I was younger, obviously I didn't quite appreciate it. But what I do very vividly remember is that then, so as I grew up, you know, I noticed like in high school or middle school, like certainly as girls were getting their periods or going through different things, like that I felt I think a lot better than most of my peers who were sort of eating standard American diet, a lot of processed snacks, taking a lot of over-the-counter medications to then feel better from the effects of, you know, processed, crappy foods. And I'll never forget it was, it's very vividly seared in my mind. But I think I want to say I was either, it was my last year of middle school or my first year of high school. That's the only part I can't quite place. And a friend had like this big bag. She was going to the bathroom and she had this big bag of Tylenol and Motrin and all of like different pills. And I said like, what is that? What are you doing? And she said, oh, I've got, I've got the worst cramps and I just feel so crappy all the time. And this is like, this is just everything. Like I have an answer for everything in here. And it really stuck with, she said, you know, don't you get horrible PMS and headaches and cramps? And I said, like, no, I really don't. And I think that was the moment that I first started associating how I was raised and what I was eating with perhaps feeling better and feeling good. And I think that was the moment that I really started appreciating it. And I don't, you know, I don't want to say like embracing it because I know there were many years, of course in college, I would order a pizza late night from a rant, you know, but there were many years that it took to get to the place I am. And I think that was the moment that I was in the place of my life. And I think that was the moment that I was raised. And I think that was the moment that I was raised. And I think that was the moment that I was raised. And I think that was the moment that I was raised. 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And I think that was the moment that I was raised. And I think that was the moment that I was raised. And I think that was the moment that I was raised. And I think that was the moment that I was raised. And I think that was the moment that I was raised. And I think that was the moment that I was raised. And knowing that you wanted to really make an impact in the food industry in a bigger way. It was so not the path that I was on. It never is. It was not the path. I was in school for... I went to school for international studies. I was doing a lot of work with the International Rescue Committee. I was working with refugees. I thought my life would go that way. I went to the new school, got my masters in international affairs. But I had this deal with my parents that if I did well in school, I could go live out this fantasy. I had a moving aspen and being a snowboard instructor for a year. Because I always loved in the mountains. And I wanted sort of what I was saying about high school and college. I think I was just a late bloomer. I was very studious in school. I didn't like let loose and have that time. And my idea of letting loose was very different than... I didn't want to let loose and get really drunk. I just wanted to just let loose and have an adventure. I called it my wild woman adventure. I was going to go live in the mountains. So that's where the aspen part comes in. I had gone skiing and grew up snowboarding and skiing. I loved it there and really wanted to teach. Be a snowboard instructor for a year. But not what I was intending to do. Knew that I always wanted to start my own thing. I had this deep feeling that I wanted to work for myself. Start my own nonprofit. Do my own music or my own writing. I really wanted to be... Sabrina is a singer. She has an album. Sabrina will not be singing on this podcast. She's the best voice. But I knew that I wanted to do my own thing. My mom had a small organic... It was called Pamela's Naturally Delicious Bake Shop for many years on the NYU campus. She did. Right next door to wear spring is. So it's very kismet or a berserk, whatever you want to say. But I just like... I always had this feeling of what natural and healthy foods gave me this sort of bright energy. And I could feel it any time I did walk into a healthy restaurant or walk into a juice bar. I was very inspired by places in LA, like the early days of Cafe Gratitude or Earth Cafe, where there's just a very warm energy. People coming in, a big bright juice bar. And I was living in Aspen. And there was nothing like that. And I really think what frustrated me for many years of my life was once you do eat that way. And you are sort of in that path. Again, it wasn't like it is today. You know, there was... There was no... You didn't walk into a coffee shop or a store and say, I'll have a latte with almond milk. Like soy milk may be at best. But that even that took a long time. And so one day I came down off the mountains. And Aspen, when I was teaching, the one vegetarian restaurant that had been there for many years closed. And there was just nowhere... I thought like everyone's so active in this town and there's just nowhere to eat, nowhere to fuel them, nowhere to feel really good. And there was a space that my now husband at the time we were just friends. We were dating by then had developed. You met that year, right? We met the year before. We had met two years ago and then that was... We had moved back for a second season before grad school. And he had this space that was just so perfect for a big, beautiful concept. Like a spring cafe. And I said to him, you know, approach all these places from LA, approach concepts like Catholic gratitude, like Earth Cafe. See if someone will come in here, tell your brokers. The town needs it. And everyone said no, Aspen is seasonal and people there want elk, chili and hamburgers. No one's gonna eat this kind of food. And I thought really? Like I really think people eat this kind of food. And I'm very stubborn. And once I get an idea in my head, I really, like I cannot let it go. It's my kiddie's heel. And my dad would say it's a blessing and a curse. And I said, if I don't do this, like if I don't find a way to start this idea or just give the idea to someone and have them start it with me, you know, I didn't know what form it would take. Someone else is gonna do it and I'm really gonna regret it. And I called my parents. I called... It's funny. Michael had a bank that wanted to come in to the space. And he still tells a story because, you know, I think it was a big deal for him to go out on his own and build like take a chance and to have going with his family business and develop this project in Colorado. And he had a bank that wanted to come in and I'll never forget the day that he called his dad and said, you know, I said no to the bank. My girlfriend's gonna open a restaurant in the space. And I, it was everyone was like, huh? What? You don't say no to a bank for your girlfriend's restaurant, especially when your girlfriend is not in the food industry. Right. But somehow I convinced a few people that we should do it. And that was 10 years ago in July. Wow. And then two years ago, we opened in New York and I knew, I remember when we opened and asked when I was driving to the opening with my dad, it was sort of a week, like we had done soft openings for a week. And the first day had gone well and then I had done something out of town and my dad was driving me and I said, Dad, next we're gonna be in New York City. And he was like, all right, girlfriend, let's just, my dad's a, you know, a realist. Right. Like he's an optimist and he's the most supportive, but he's a realist. And he's like, let's just dial it back and you got one. Right. Like we don't need more restaurants. Let's, let's, let's see how this one goes. Focus on what's gonna be. I said, no dad, it's gonna be in New York one day. And he was like, all right. And I just said, you don't even need to tell anyone just, it's sort of what you say. You don't need to talk about it all the time. You just need to put, keep putting it out, pen to the paper or like, you know, just put in the work, like as you said to quote you. And so I said, you know, no one has to believe me now, but this little, this little, like one day I'm going to have a restaurant in New York. And it took, took almost 10 years and we had COVID in between and, and a lot of things we never saw coming, but you did it. I'm doing it. You're doing it. I'm trying to do it. It's hard. I'm just going to be a moment in my life when I can be like, I, I did it. I mean, but you did it and now you're doing it. I'm doing it. And there's just ever growing challenges. Yes. And I've, and I've learned that. And that's what's been really interesting is I think I used to think that once you'd, that there was this moment when you made it and things were really easy. And so anytime something happened, I would get really devastated and upset and I would let it shake my entire world view and my core and I would be a disaster. And then I realized like, no, there's never a moment when there are not challenges. Just you get to a moment where you said that's being an entrepreneur and being a business owner. And it took me, that's why I'm grateful for friends like you and other female entrepreneurs and female founders are just good girlfriends who also are business owners, whatever you want to call it. Because yes, like we have play days with our kids and, you know, we have a lot of fun together and we do birthdays and we joke around and we travel. But there are many times like, you know, we were on the ski slopes together, stopping at every run. Literally. Almost in tears, like I have this problem and you and Noah were giving me advice and, you know, Michael was, it's like to me, that's just, it made me realize everybody has. Once, if you're a founder and you're an entrepreneur, you have issues that arise every day. The other thing that I want to do is, you know, I want to be a business owner and I want to be a business owner. And I want to be a business owner. I want to be a business owner. I want to be a business owner. I want to be a business owner. I want to be a business owner. I want to be a business owner. I want to be a business owner. I want to be a business owner. I want to be a business owner. I want to be a business owner. I want to be a business owner. I want to be a business owner. I want to be a business owner. I want to be a business owner. I want to be a business owner. I want to be a business owner. I want to be a business owner. I want to be a business owner. Realization too, after all of these years of being in business and also understanding that like I was the person who was rattled by every single thing. It was like, if something went wrong, I was down and I will say, listen, there are a lot of things that happen. And what I'm really come to understand within myself is like, I've gotten so much stronger and things that are thrown at me. I can handle them differently. I face things differently where I still cry, by the way, so do I. We cry together. We cry together. But I think that's important to process. 100%. So it's like I have these stages where it's like first, the problem arises. The second, I'm like in shock. The third, it hits. And I have to get it out. I have to. Or else I just hold it and it brews and then it explodes elsewhere. And then I find the solution. Exactly. You have to cry and scream. I have to cry and say everything's falling apart. That's my process. The world is falling apart. My life is over. And then my dad has this great expression. He always says, is it a problem or is it a worry? He's like Sabrina, if God forbid your kids were sick, that's a worry. You're just leaving. That's a problem. And problems have solutions and you can solve it. You don't have to worry about a problem. Save the worry for the real worries in life. Ooh, that's right. The problems, you solve the problem. I love it. So now whenever something happens, like they call me from the cafe or there's something crisis or, you know, there's some turmoil in my life, I say, is this a problem or is this a worry? That's great. I give myself a few days, have my meltdown, call you, call other friends. And then I'm like, all right, team, let's solve this because we got to solve it. We're in deep now. We got to solve it. You have to be solution oriented if you're an entrepreneur. You just have to be or else you're going to take your team down. It's just it really hold you hold the energy. So I think it's super important. It's taken me a little while to like get to this place of really understanding that it really does funnel from the top down. But to just recap one more thing on spring cafe because you know I'm your biggest fan. You're my biggest fan. You're my PR advertising. I just am so I'm so in love with everything that you do. And even you liked it. I sometimes think about that. Like when you first went and asked when years ago, like what if you had hated the food? We may not be here. What about a really big problem? I'm obsessed with it. I'm glad you love it. I love it and I love that it's like in my neighborhood. And I mean, I'm definitely your number one customer. You definitely are. 100%. My team is like very primed for when you come. Like if there's a mullet there like we have an order for Melissa. We need to we need to do this. Not for me. They're like we got it. It's Melissa. They're always amazing. 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You wake up in the morning and you feel like a different person. The code for a discount is move with heart. That's no spaces. And this can be used on array.com. That's a R R A E dot com at the checkout for 15% off or for 25% off the first month of the subscription. I can't say it enough. I know I've said it a lot, but I'm absolutely in love with this product. And the truth is it's because it's effective and it works wonders. Don't trust me. Definitely try it on for yourself and experience some real movement. If you know what I'm saying. But I really want to dive into which I know our listeners are going to want so much from you because I feel like every time we're together, I always leave with a new ounce of money. Like there's something new that you've taught me or there's a homeopathy that I've purchased. You're just a very willing participant. Well, no, because you've shared things that have really impacted my life, my children's lives. And I want to take this lifestyle that you've created, but now it's like this is a part of your life. And before we even go there, you guys, I have to share this one story because this is when Sabrina and I first met. I don't know what she's going to share. This is so good. And we were on a panel. It was a wellness panel. And they're asking us our non-negotiables and I have my non-negotiable and then Sabrina will expand on her non-negotiable, but it's about food dye and she's very verbal about this. And I support this 100%. But she will really take it to extreme measures to make sure her kids aren't exposed to things. And they're exposed. I just like them to have another option. Yeah, you're in. It's amazing. And I love how passionate you are. But she shared on this panel. Do you want to share it? Do you want me to? I don't know exactly which part of it. Well, she shared on this panel that if she goes to a kids birthday party, she'll call the parent ahead of time to see. This is when you had, I think you had two kids. Yeah. To see what they're serving, like what sweets. And then she will show up with a yeti cooler of a different option. This is me. I was like, no, it's a lot crazy. Not crazy when they am, but I do do that. But in context, it was a lot easier when my kids were younger. But yes, when especially, I would say until my first hit like the age of five and a half six, because truly before that he didn't notice, I would just call the parent hosting the birthday and I would say, you know, we, I mean, I don't even have to call most people and know me at that, you know, they're like, I can just text and say, what are you serving? And if it was a cupcake or pizza, I would bring dairy free gluten free pizza and I would bring healthy cupcake options, but I would match. I took it really seriously. Like if they said they had cupcakes with blue icing, I would call baby cakes and get a cupcake with blue icing because, you know, yes, it's only once in a while, but when you're going to multiple birthday parties, a little bit adds up to a lot. And I'm just, I see, I've said this very publicly before many times, I'm just never willing to accept the crap for lack of a better word that we feed our kids and ourselves in this country. And I'm never going to happily and willingly give my children that food dye, preservatives, tons of candy, all of these things that I don't even think they're not even foods fit for human consumption, but somehow we serve them to humans. And so I would, you know, like if I was going to an ice cream party, I would bring a yeti cooler of tons of different popsicle options. And everybody, you know, a lot of people like, Oh, you're poor kids. It's what my mom did with me. But the truth is my kids didn't care. They didn't even know that they didn't even know the difference. And at the age that they started learning the difference, I always give them the choice. And the funny thing is, is like my older son will always eat the pizza at a party now because now he's old enough. Like I don't ever want him to feel self-conscious or embarrassed. The regular pizza, the regular pizza, you know, and he's older now he's seven and he's okay. If he has a little gluten and dairy once a while, is it my favorite? No, would I like all of his dairy to be organic, grass fed, pastured? Would I like that for every person on the planet? If you're going to eat dairy? Yes, that's unfortunately not the way of the world. So now when we go to a party, if he wants a slice of pizza, he has a slice of pizza. If he wants the dessert, he has the dessert. But what I will say is that especially for my middle and usually for my older, they'll take three bites of the of the real, you know, if it is like a big giant cake with all this blue icing or something else and they'll come over to me and be like, Mom. And I'll say, yes, they'll say, Mom, we don't like, we don't like this. Can we throw it away and can we go to lifetime and get something or like, can we go to spring cafe and get something after? Can we go to Van Lewin? And I'll say, like, of course. And because they, another thing I always say is like, taste buds are made not born. Like when you raise your kid for seven years on not artificial crap, your body knows that and notices the difference. And when you eat or you're fed artificial crap, you know, they can tell like they don't feel good. It doesn't taste great to them. And to this day, if you ask me if I want ice cream, I don't think of hog and does. I think of like coconut bliss because that's, you know, that's just what my body recognizes as ice cream. That doesn't mean that I don't love a great gelato or I can't enjoy a delicious soft serve. Like you saw me do the other night, but it's not, it's just not to me what I associate with ice cream. When someone says, do you want dessert or, you know, people are asking like, do you eat candy? Because I wasn't, I tried it going up. I always tasted or snuck it from a friend's house. But I think when you're not raised on it and your body doesn't interact, because we all know like there are many interactions our bodies and our minds have with things like food dye, things like white sugar, things like chemicals and flavorings and artificial flavorings. There are chemicals and interactions that happen and you know, most of them unfortunately are negative, horrible. And I think when your body is not used to that, it has like an internal signal that says, whoa, I don't love the way this feels. When my kid eats red or blue food dye, he doesn't have a great reaction. They act so wild. They act wild and they just can tell like he'll be like, I don't, I don't feel good from all that sugar or something. I don't, you know, so yes, I did do bring a Yeti. I am still that way with the baby. So for me, it's like from one until like five, I'm really strict because I think those are really important years when their brains are developing and their taste buds are developing. And so when we go to a party now, even if the older one is getting what he wants, the middle one still honestly doesn't notice. So he'll like come to me and say, you know, he wants something else and the baby gets full on cooler of rice, milk ice cream. Like the baby is not, I'm not giving the baby a, I'm with you, you know, a Mr. Softy cone. And I still, I try to choose like the best of a bad situation, you know, and I have, I have no issues saying to my son, no, you can't have that giant red, like whatever. I don't even know what it is, but you can have this option, like just the plane, you know, you can have softer from the ice cream truck with blacks with like the chocolate sprinkles. Right. And I've explained it, I say there's just some foods that don't make us feel great inside and that do things to our bodies that we maybe can't see, but it's still doing something yucky to our bodies. And I don't, I don't see an issue with that with like bringing kids into that narrative early. No, I'm, I'm so with you. I mean, I remember being like, whoa, she's, this is next level. I don't think that helped my campaign with our friendship. That, that panel. I don't think she's chill and cool and I should be her, her best friend. Now, no, I literally was like, well, I don't do that, but like I respect that you get to that level. You're one of the only friends that I have that I don't have to bring anything to their birthdays. And maybe it's because of that panel and you like, just do it because you think I'm psycho. But you, that that's truly my favorite. Well, no, you know, I'm super passionate about this is a lot of people talk about this and then you go to their birth and you're like, really? Like, right. I should never be an excuse or an opportunity to just feed kids food that we know makes them sick. It's true. Especially kids. And not to me is the hardest part, a friend of mutual friend of ours said this on another podcast a few days ago. What makes her the saddest and I really agreed with her was it's like the parents who know better are just like, we're going to do it anyway. And I always, like, I have this dream of one, like one year on Halloween that will just go trick or treating and all the blocks and houses that we go to instead of having like the Tootsie rolls and the blow pops will have the Yum Earth and the other, the other candies, especially families that have, you know, that have the means to and that have access to it and have the knowledge because it just saddens me like that this is what people are offered. But I love you because I go to your birthdays and you never have that crap. Like you always have cupcakes that are naturally died, naturally sweetened. Your candy is Yum Earth that you stuff in the pinata. And to me, that's like, that's just such a better option. It makes me so happy when I can just bring my kids to a place. And that's why I really, that's the only reason I do like that's the only reason I go on Instagram. That's the only reason I keep going is not the only, but the biggest reason is because I just really hope that like, that's the way the world is going. And you know, if however many people that listen to this podcast that you know what next you're on Halloween, we're going to switch out our candy. That to me is like a really big thing because people like mom, like we have purchasing power. The food companies and big food and big pharma and big agriculture can only get away with this stuff because we're okay with it because we keep buying it. It's true. We make marshmallows and you know, candies with chemicals and food diets. Everybody just got together, people who were in a position to do so and said, we're not okay with this, then they would be forced to change it. And that would trickle down to places like food deserts where people don't have the luxury or the option or the means to choose because that's like they're literally like food wastelands in this country with only bad options. But we as moms, like we have purchasing power, we have the ability to make big companies change just by whether we go for it or we don't go for it. So if everyone next year decided to go to the health food store, everyone listening, I should say, if they can do what you can, maybe it's a little bit, you know, maybe it's less, could just buy a certain amount of healthy candy, like that makes a dent. And then food companies are forced to say, oh, well, if there's enough of an uproar, nobody's buying this, like we're going to have to change this, you know? So we've come very far, but we still have a long way to go. And that's why I'm so crazy about it or, you know, bring my yaddie or say that I bring my yaddie because we should not accept like, oh, we're just going to live in a world with food that gives kids cancer and makes kids sick and causes all kinds of behavioral disorders, which then causes people to go on drugs for those behavioral disorders, which then causes another issue. Like that is not the system that we have to resign to. I'm so with you. So, you know, like I know more and that's why I love you. I do. And I mean, look, I will tell you because even just having people in your corner who like reignite your passion for these things, right? Like listening to him like, yes, like we can create more of a movement. Like I'm thinking of Bonnie Hari and Fubey. She's a, I mean, she's amazing. And she's challenging. Yes, exactly. She's changing the food industry. And just like you said, moms have the purchasing power, like emails. Mom's really do. If thousands of moms, you know, went to the supermarket and said like, we're not buying this crap, food companies would have to listen. It's just that we don't think we have the power. We don't think it's important enough. We think, oh, once in a while, it doesn't matter. It matters. Like we have all kinds of epidemics and crises in this country. And a lot of it is very interrelated with the food that we eat and the what we feed our kids and what we nourish ourselves with and what we don't nourish ourselves with. You know, there's a lot of talk in my son's school about, oh, certain boys in the class are really wild. And, you know, they, they can't keep their attention or they're disruptive by the time it gets to after lunch. And I said to the, like one of the directors of the school the other day, I said, I came to pick up my middle son from school and like the snack, the birthday snack was a brownie with 44 grams of sugar from a plastic package, 44 grams of sugar for a three year old in the middle of a school day. My older son, like he gets a granola bar and some potato chips. Like if you're not looking at the link between what you're giving them for snack and then what's happening an hour or two later when their blood sugar crashes, we got to have a bigger conversation. So to me, it's like, I will not, I will never stop sort of living that way and putting that out there and sharing what I can and showing people what I can. Because the more I get as, you know, like the more you're here on board, like, what is that cool is that it's amazing and we have the power to shift this movement. I want to say this because I do think it's really important, like much like yourself. I, you know, I would swap out all of the candy, but then to it at a certain place at a certain age, they know it's like, these like, why does everyone have the ring pop after school? And you know, it pains me to give him a red or blue ring pop because of the food dye and his behavior after is just, it's such an astronomical difference than if I were to give him a young earth lollipop. But I do have these moments where I'm like, I lean in a little bit because of the push, right? And it's like, I've had to too. Yeah. And it is something like I'm really finding that place of like, okay, allowing certain things and then really trying to give better options and then sometimes having just like, no, you can't go for the multicolored food dye, icy pop thing in the past. I've said yes to that. Like I've said yes and thought that my, like I was like, I never in my life thought this would happen, right? But want, because I didn't want it to become so taboo because I agree with you. You don't want it to become so taboo. You'll go the other direction, but also being okay saying now. And honestly, I'm really lucky. Like, I think just because I'm so persistent and annoying, a lot of parents who are like this already, but maybe needed that little shove, like they buy out like, I'm like, oh, don't like hear the popsicle. You should get these popsicles. The kids love them and then they buy them after school and then all the kids are happy in the pot. You know, like that to me is what's really fun is when another parent is like, you know, why am I, I don't need to buy this. Like, let me buy the one Luki can eat and my kids would do better with that too. It's so true. It makes me really happy. And that's why I never shy away from sort of saying like, there might be another option. We did a live recently over the weekend, a few weekends ago and in prom do live and you shared incredible advice on how to really like detox your kitchen. I feel like for people listening, can you share? I think you can like touch on those five things that we went through, but also I think it feels overwhelming for people who don't necessarily live these lifestyles right now, but they want to, they want a better their health. They want to feel better. And that's what this is all about. Can you share some things that you think can really make a difference in someone's life with just some small steps to take and I love the way that we share that on the live because they're very tangible and they feel doable. So you might have to help me remember all the things we share in life, but I know the big one was like how I wash my produce and, you know, obviously we now live in a world where if you're at all interested in this kind of lifestyle, you understand that the relationship between like your immune system, your gut health, your mind, your brain, gut access and like having all these unnecessary like pesticides, amoebas, bugs in your gut, you get enough of that during the day and unfortunately we don't live with like super healthy soil. So taking all of that off your produce is just like better in the long run for you. So I shared about how to wash your produce and it was funny because a lot of people like commented a rodent and they were like, this is so neurotic, this is crazy. What like who would wash their produce like this? And then yesterday I was actually soaking my produce and like there's no bugs on pro like where are you buying your and I didn't even go to the farmer's market yesterday. I just went to the health food store and bought packaged organic like produce. And so I was soaking it in the sink in the kitchen and I had used, I do three drops or four drops of grapefruit seed extract. You could also do food, great hydrogen peroxide. And in the sink were so many like bugs and dirt. And so I took a story and I was like, everyone asking why I soaked my produce this way here is your actual living proof living like all these little tentacles and creepy crawlers of why I soaked my produce and then everyone was writing and, all right, you made a believer of me, we just ordered it like, can you link the live with Melissa or like reshare how you did this? And I'm like, that's all I had to do was show people the bugs and then that's what you can see, what you can't see are like the pesticides and that leeches in. So no amount of soaking can really help you with that. But one is just to, you know, to wash your produce to get rid of any kinds of like added viruses, amoebas, bugs that you don't need and I do a grapefruit seed extract. I love that. Which is like used all over the world for gut health whenever I'm like, whenever you're traveling, you can even put a few drops in your water. If you're in a place where you're not sure about the what like, you know, I've traveled all over the world and like used that sometimes just for gut health. Or if you ever have like an amoeba or a parasite, like people use that sometimes obviously to talk to your doctors, but just that's why I use that on my produce or food grade hydrogen peroxide. And then I think another one we did was again, talking about these like forever chemicals and endocrine disruptors and people don't realize, not because they don't want to, just because there's so much bombarding them telling them it's okay. You know, like people don't realize how toxic their cookware is. So a lot of people are cooking in aluminum pots, a lot of people are cooking with non-toxic like, you know, cookware that has PTFE's or other forever chemicals that really can mess up your hormones, mess up your endocrine system and leach into your system and stay there and cause a whole host of health problems. So obviously it's, you know, if you can like do what you can, but replacing your aluminum cookware with stainless steel cookware, like a set of all clad stainless steel or other brands, and there are a range of prices that you can find if you do a little digging on Amazon and then maybe just investing in like one really good non-stick skillet. If you do a lot of cooking in a non-stick like for your eggs or other things like the caraway home or a green pan, green pans are really affordable option. You can get different sizes for different prices on Amazon or, you know, like through green pan and getting rid of the aluminum, getting rid of those forever chemicals that are in non-stick cookware because like what you put in now will really make a difference in your health in the long run. Like you don't, you don't want to store heavy metals in your body and you don't, people don't realize that cooking your food in these materials is contributing to illness and making you sick. It's not just like what you eat, it's how you eat it and how you prep it. And that goes for aluminum foil, like, you know, a lot of people love to cook in aluminum. So you can still use aluminum foil, but you can just take a sheet of parchment paper and put it inside your aluminum. Like if you're baking a potato, wrap the potato in parchment covered in the aluminum and that will stop you from leaching a lot of like, billi yucky heavy metals like aluminum into your food. And then I think just being more conscientious about what you're consuming like reading labels like things like spices that can be irradiated or have, you know, a lot of chemicals through the processing of them. Like maybe choose a few spices that are non irradiated, you know, a gentler processing and things like that, you know, things like being more mindful about things like food dies, things like chemicals or, you know, artificial natural flavors in your food and just making us your number one thing, would you say? Like if you were my number one thing. Like an overall health, I would say my number one is just, yeah, what keeps me up at night is there's things like of just fake food, just artificial chemicals, dead artificial colors, things that we know are literally carcinogens, things that we know cause grave illness and health consequences, like for children that then become adults that face those. And so you will never, yeah, I mean, that is like, I will say yes occasionally if I really feel that I need to to not make something taboo like out of birthday or, but I will, I will never buy that for my kids. I am, I am vigilant when it comes to those types of ingredients because for me, I think if we were to just cut that out, we'd be so much better, right? Like if people could just make that one small change, like every day if you pick your kid up with a lollipop, just make it a Yarmouth lollipop instead of a Tootsie Pop, that alone is making a huge difference. So that's probably my number one. That's like the one thing that I'm, I guess you could say the strictest about or that I, you know, like my one most non-negotiable. But I feel like I need you to write a book at this point, are ready to just like store this all. I would love to. And then I, well, we're waiting. We're all waiting. I would like give me, give me just like your top supplements that you swear by. And I know you're not a doctor, but like what are things that you take that you think are crucial. Vitamin C every day for me and my kids. The kids take sodium, a score bait powder. It's just really easily absorbed taste sign and mix it in their water. I take light with some, we'll see vitamin D three K two because as much as we try, we don't like living in New York City or the Northeast, we don't get enough vitamin D and, you know, absorbable forms unless you're out in the sun. And I do try to get sun exposure daily, like for that reason. I always, always have charcoal on hand always because my kids get stomach bugs. They throw up in the night and it works for me like a charm, but aren't you supposed to take it on an empty stomach? No, so charcoal, like I keep charcoal powder in the house and then, but just for an illness. So like if one of my kids is nauseous or they throw up, it's sort of like nature's peptobysmal. It's made from like the charcoal from coconuts basically. And you like I give them a little bit of that in water and small sips when they're throwing up and it immediately stops whatever's going on and helps them like move through. So I always have that on hand and a few other sort of like gut healthy supplements like that that help with like a stomach bug. We rely a lot on homeopathic remedies, you know, for getting cold. I know have like everything from you. And it's, it's, I'm not, you know, we've, we've also had to take antibiotics. We've also had to take over that we've had to take a steroid cream for the baby because he had some, you know, there have been moments when obviously regular, you know, Western medicine, whatever you want to call it. Great. Like comes in handy, but for me, it's like, I like to minimize what I can with all of that and really maximize things that help the body work through the process and like support the body and moving through all these illnesses. And while our kids are building their immune systems, while we're all building our immune systems through these last crazy years. So I would say like vitamin C, vitamin D, three K two, charcoal, and then just a few, there's an amazing book by Dana Ollman. It's called everybody's guide to homeopathy. And my mom has used it since I was born. My son was up last night screaming with ear pain. And I went into the bathroom at 1am because the remedy I usually use wasn't working for him. And I read quickly through the book on the section on ear aches. And I like I, from his symptoms, chose the remedy, gave it and within 20 minutes, he was asleep. So I do recommend that book if you're interested in homeopathy and again, not a doctor, just someone, you know, who was raised this way and likes to share with anyone who wants to listen. But in conjunction with your other remedies or, you know, medicines, whatever you take, if you're looking for a more gentle option, I would recommend that book. I think I think that that is sort of like the bible of, of homeopathic medicine. And if anyone's interested in really like, that's better than any supplement is just like having that and being able to look in the night. Oh my God, I cannot wait to get that because you have, you've turned me on to homeopathy and ask me the other day. I mean, I know I literally left the doctor. I was like, hold on a second. I need to say no, of course I, you know, like you said, you take things into there are situations where you have to give your kids certain things. But I think having alternatives to, you know, things that are being shoved down our throat is really important and knowledge is power. Knowledge is power. And I think that the shame is that two things can exist, right? Two truths can exist. Like, we can use all that other stuff when we need it. But also natural holistic medicines and supplements are really powerful and they work. And oh, that's the other supplement I would have. V clear. What? Because anytime you can start getting sick, I give a few drops and I have that. I have that. Or rest it right away. Like it really stops it in its tracks. So I love that. It really does. If you have kids. But I think that there's like this great fear, you know, like, oh, if you share this, you'll get canceled or like if you, if you say this, it means you're opposed to this. No, like I was raised a certain way. I really believe in it. My whole life is centered around it. And I'm very delighted to share the parts that work for me in case they also work for you. And if they don't, they don't leave it and keep doing what you're doing. Exactly. It's, I think that's a lot to do with social media too. Like Instagram is a weird place and it's sort of like an echo chamber and a tunnel. And you realize like, that's just Instagram. I know. That's not the world. There's a whole world outside of Instagram. So, you know, like I'm sharing something on a podcast. If it works for a few people out there, amazing. If there's another parent with ear pain tonight and you know, like, balladonna helps her get due because she read it in the book. Great. Like, and if it doesn't, it doesn't. It's amazing. I mean, you guys have to follow spring, spring by Sabrina for all of this sort of stuff. Spring, I've asked when you can also follow if you want to know our daily specials or just keep up with the. I feel like I could just keep asking you a million questions. But we're going to just wrap it up with a rapid fire because I'm not good at rapid fire. By the way, I'm nothing I do. I'm not. I'm not. When we came in here, because I was like, I can't do rapid fire. What if I say three different things? She's like, that's okay. I'm the same. What gets you out of bed in the morning? My kids literally figure it out. Sabrina has three beautiful boys. Yes. What motivates you when you're feeling down? Probably also my kids, but more just like just being a mom in general and like, because they're so oblivious to so much of what keeps me down. And I think it's just that sort of like joy and just very necessary necessity to be present for them is what sort of motivates me when I'm feeling down. Like I can't, you can't, when you're a mom, you can't stay in something for so long because the next thing is like, you're needed or you're wanted or there's an issue with something else with another kid so that urgency to be very much in the present moment is what motivates me when I'm down. I'm with you there. What's your, I'm curious for this one. What's your end all be all self-care ritual? As three years ago, probably like surfing, going surfing or just, you know what it is? It's a free day. It's what's up. Like exactly. But it's like you just cancel your day or you say no to everything or instead of going to the gym or to something like you just, you go back to sleep for a night. Like it's just the idea of a free day. That to me, it's not a facial, it's not a massage, it's not, it's like you have endless, you could just sit and do nothing or just stare out the window and daydream. Like that truly to me. The other, I'll give you, I know this is so not rapid. This is like the opposite of round fire. No, it's fine. Give it. Because I have one more question I need to ask you. But last a few nights ago, I was really having a day. Like my eldest has been sick, we hadn't slept and my husband had just gotten home. It's like that, you know, like my, my, our babysitter calls it rush hour, like the hour between like dinner bath that like everyone's. And I was like, I just, before I go do, before I nurse for 30 minutes, before I read four books, before I do this, I just want to eat an ice cream cone in peace in my clean bedroom that I just decluttered. And so I went to the freezer and I got a vegan ice cream cone. I didn't tell anyone where I was going. I knew they were fine. They yelled for me a few times, didn't answer. Because my husband, like I knew, you know, like everyone, nobody was in danger. Right. And I literally just sat in the chair in my room. My eldest actually found me, which was really funny. And I was like, I hit the ice cream cone behind a book. And he was like, what are you doing? And then he's like, I want a chocolate ice cream cone. But for like a good 20 minutes, I just sat in my room in silence. That's so nice. Eating an ice cream cone, just staring out at the view from my window, daydreaming. And I, it was truly like, I was so happy that I had done that. I love doing stuff like that. That, that to me is the ultimate, maybe just because, because when you have kids, it's, you don't get that very often, but that's like the ultimate to me. It's just like a free moment, free time. I'm so with you. What is your cult favorite beauty product? That's hard. Can we just also mention that you don't do Botox? Like you're very, no, I like this. Thank you for outing. No, I love it. Is that okay? I have a lot of wrinkles. No. Are you kidding? You're stunning. I don't, I don't do Botox. No, but I love it. But it's just not. No, I know. I love that you. It's up there with food dye for me. Like I just can't. Right. Can you share why? I'm not conducting like a toxin. I mean, I don't, I have many wonderful friends who all do Botox. No, of course. And they, you know, I love them and I'm fully supportive of anyone doing whatever they want, but just for me personally, it just, I can't, I just can't get behind that. I'm just not willing to take the health, like the, you know, the trade off for me is just not, I'm not going to inject that into my, into my bloodstream. No, I respect it. But, and I love, I love you so openly with some wrinkles. So you're stunning. Okay. Oh, what's my call? Oh, wait. Oh, yeah. What's your favorite beauty product? I think like a, either the Bayo, the bear, the Bayo bear tint. It's like my favorite thing. It's like a lipstick on a cheek tint. Yes. You always share that. Or I thought I'm obsessed with it. It's an amazing brand. And the founders are like the two most, like one of the founders is like the most holistic. They have great baby products. They're amazing baby products. And they're like super like holistic earth mamas and I just feel very seen by them. So like I love them. Or like I love the Quora organics face masks. Love Quora. Like not like any, any like face mask by them. But the Bayo stick is truly my like clutch beauty item and the tinted one because they make a bear and a tinted and the tinted you can literally go like after the shower. And it's just. And you look really like you look good. Like you look good. I have to try it. I mean, not this good, but you look good. Yeah. I love it. I feel like we need you. You guys, I, you have to write in. I feel like we need Sabrina to write a blog post on what if they all write in and they're like get rid of this? No, they're all going to be very. To write in. No, I feel like it would be like I want a breakdown of like skincare products, like products you use for the baby, for the kids. You are a novel. I want your novel. I want your novel. Can I just write a novel? Yeah. Actually, yes, you are a beautiful writer. Okay. Last but not least, because this podcast is called move with heart. What does it mean to you to move with your heart? You are a heart leader. Oh gosh, I love you. Oof. You saved like the hardest for last. I noticed it is, but it isn't. Just stay with it. I think what does it mean to me to move with heart? I would say to just to keep your optimism, like to be, I've always been a true optimist. And I think there have been many moments of turmoil or many storms in my life that I did not see coming, like throw over, you know, the years of becoming a mom or becoming a business owner. And I think to just keep your hopeless optimism and your sort of joy for life in even in the darkest moments is probably what that means to me. Like to just really, to just say it's going to be okay, like just keep on keeping on. And just like it sounds so cheesy, but just smile and be joyful and be grateful. You are like that. That is how you live your life. Thanks, I try. I mean, I'm sure my husband and kids would say otherwise on some of my darkest moments, but after I scream and yell and you know, you come back, like drop a mango all over the floor. I try to return to that state of being. Well you come back quickly. I try. I do. I do. It's funny. I'm not with Michael about this because I'm like, he's like, because I do, I try to bounce back right away. Like I can, my family was a lot like that. Like you have a huge screaming fight and then you just get it out and you're okay. Right. And you can, and you can come back and I really am like that. I don't, I don't like to hold a garage. I don't like to take anything with me. I like to just go back to that state of being. Get it out guys. It really makes a difference. Let it go and smile. I love you and I love all of the things that you share. Keep sharing. This was so fun. Keep going. Thanks for giving me a space to do it. And I feel like I already have an organized like, oh gosh, ass. Well, I, I realize there's, there's more, there's more need from you. Let's, we should do like a cooking series or something or like go like a kitchen series. You know, I do. Remember ideas. I love you. I love you. Thank you. Bye. I hope you guys enjoyed that episode. God, I have to say it still feels so good to share that the evolution of the MWH platform is finally here. And we are giving you so much more on the platform with your membership. We have a very special offer for our move with heart listeners. We've never done this before. For new members in addition to your seven day free trial, we are giving your first entire month for free. That's another 30 days free. You guys, we never do this. All you have to do is head to Melissawood health.com and use code move with heart. All lowercase, no spaces when you sign up for a monthly membership. Let me tell you, if you did not know this already, MWH now offers so much more. I cannot emphasize that enough in every category to help guide you in both movement and meditation so you can feel not only your absolute best in your body, but most importantly, in your mind. So don't forget to get your first month free use code move with heart when you sign up for a monthly membership at Melissawood health.com and follow me on Instagram at Melissawood Tepperberg and MWH at Melissawood health on Instagram and TikTok. I cannot wait to see you all on the map. Bye. Bye. the next week. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. ♪♪♪