JAMIE CAMPBELL on The Toronto Blue Jays

♪♪ It's the Bob A. Cowan podcast brought to you by Bette Rivers. Download the Bette Rivers Online Casino and Sportsbook app today. Of course with John Shannon. Oh, Robert. Yeah, nice week. Yeah, nice weekend, I hope. Yeah, you know, it was a gardening weekend, Bob. Was it? I spent the week in Friday, Saturday, Sunday in the garden. I love the garden. The plants don't talk back. It's really fun. That's right. Are they starting to grow? It's starting to grow, are they? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. We're getting there. It's a little early in Ontario for gardens, but I was not going to be deterred. Good for you. I'll let you know when the people who I hire to do my garden come by. And I'll let you know how they're doing. Would they like some? I'm not doing anything. Would they like some pointers? I don't think so. I don't think they care the least about what I know they don't care what I say. And I don't care what you say either to tell you the truth. Sorry about that. So how about your hockey team? Your hockey team. Not my hockey team. Yes. Well, they're one of them. I have 32 of those. I'll defend all 32. You know that. I'll defend all 32, Bob. Listen, we'll get to the Maple Leafs at the end of the program. Okay. I'll talk to you about that. But we're talking about the Blue Jays a bit. Who railed off three convincing victories in Pittsburgh this weekend. And victories they probably needed. You don't want to get too far behind Tampa Bay and they're already about seven games back. So Jamie Campbell does the Blue Jays Podcast as everybody knows. And he will join us when we come back after this message. Hi, this is Bob McCowan for BetRivers.com. Hey, if you're looking for a sports book or casino app, you should check out the Bet Rivers Sports and Casino app today. Play all of your favorite casino games for real money. Anywhere. And anytime. Plus get in the action with each sports game with hundreds of sports betting options. And get ready to feel like a VIP because you'll earn both loyalty level points and bonus store points on every real money wager you make. You must be 19 plus available in Ontario only. Please play responsibly. If you have questions or concerns about your gambling or someone close to you, contact Connex Ontario at 1 866 531 2600 or speak to an advisor free of charge. BetRivers.com. This is also a funny game. Blue Jays there's a bunch in a row and you get all panicky and then they win a bunch in a row and you feel pretty good about them again. Now mind you, they beat the Pittsburgh Pirates who we think are a bad team. Seven games ago. They were good. Seven games. Well, they got off to an unbelievable start, but now it's sideways. Jamie Campbell joins us to talk a little bit about them. What did you expect this weekend with Pittsburgh? I expected a better team than the one I saw considering they were 20 and 12 when that series began. And I know they're in a, shall we say, a soft division. But goodness, if you're going to win 20 games that quickly, put up a fight for goodness sakes and they did not at all. I mentioned post game after the victory on Sunday that the Blue Jays had 40 at bats over the course of three games with runners in scoring position. That's how often they had an opportunity to bring somebody home. Yeah, well, and they killed them in three games. The four nothing game in the first run was was was nothing compared to what happened afterwards on Saturday and Sunday to and what 10 one yesterday. It was a pretty awesome performance. This Blue Jays team is so interesting. You know, you look at them individually and collectively and they look like they will win a lot of games and they probably will. But, you know, they've had some problems offensively. They've had some guys who have not hit well. How much do you think how much work do you think they're doing on that right now? That's a great question. Where George Springer is concerned and he is of all of them. It seems right now the one guy that seems to be a bit alarming in in his skid, although historically he's been streaky and he did come out of it a little bit in Pittsburgh. He hit a pretty important home run in the second game, first game of that series, pardon me. And with guys like that, you know, and I think you've heard John Schneider say this. I don't think you worry long term about them struggling. And I think the same applies to Brandon Belt who had a wonderful series against Pittsburgh despite a ridiculous experience. He's got it together out of nowhere really. And he figured it out too. And then what you see is the case of Dalton Barcho, which is kind of fascinating, where he made a very, very slight mechanical change that allowed him to get greater access to the baseball, apparently. And I think it was very interesting that you could do something that seems so subtle and it could have such a profound effect because his bats come around too. He hit one into the Allegheny yesterday. I know. Yeah. And I don't think that happens very often at PNC Park. That wasn't you jumping in after the ball, Jamie? I thought it was Arden's well and quite frankly, before doing a post game interview. That's going to be cold water. I was thinking this thing at this time of year, are you kidding me coming out of coming out of Northern Pennsylvania? Oh my God, that would have been cold. Jump in the room for a baseball really. Yeah, not worth it. I'll buy you one at Dix. Yeah, not yet. How patient can they be or will they be to think with Springer in the lead off position? Very simply because he's got a track record, John. And I think he sits third all time in career home runs from the lead off position. So I don't think you're going to see a change there. There are just some players that you don't mess with in terms of their position in the batting order. And I believe George Springer is one of them. You can move guys around the way Varshos bin four, five and six. Brandon Belt has no issue hitting seventh. Kevin Kermier knows exactly where he's hitting every day and that's usually nights. But guys like Springer, he'll figure it out eventually and he'll go on some two week tear and we'll forget that this all happened. Well, let's talk about Kermier. Let's talk a little bit about him because his statistics do not make him a traditional number nine hitter or do they? You know, is he there to get on base in front of, you know, the big guys at the top of the lineup? It depends on how you view his productivity. And I don't see an issue with having a guy in the nine spot who, you know, in his own words has no interest in hitting home runs. He wants to be the greatest number nine singles hitter in 2023. And so far he's doing a pretty darn good job of it. And to cause the kind of havoc that he can cause and both Joe Sittle and Caleb Joseph point this out frequently. Speed has a way of really messing up pitchers who know who's standing over at first base or in Kermier's case second. If he's been able to stretch one from a single to a double. You saw it in perfect form with a little roller off the bat of what Maryfield yesterday and he beat it out. And, you know, speed has that impact on an infielder has it on the pitcher as well. I love where Kermier is in the lineup to be able to turn that lineup over as frequently as he seems to be able to do that. I think is very productive. Even if Springer is struggling, you've got bull right there behind him. Glad these when he's healthy hitting third. So if he's comfortable there and he's, you know, working some walks every now and then and picking up the odd base. I think he's perfectly suited for that spot. The key thing for me on Kermier is how long can he stay healthy because that's his ammo, right? Well, so far so good, right? But that's the concern that one has over. I mean, look at the way the Yankees are dealing with injuries right now and have since opening day. That's what baseball is over 162. You know, all the panic after the four game sweep in Boston. I mean, I had to go on social media and remind people, hey, listen, this is part of a larger project that will end sometime in either late September or early October. And injuries are part of this. And at some point, I'm sure somebody's going to get hurt and be at long term for this ball club. And the question becomes, do you have viable backups? Do you have depth, whether that's at the Major League roster or down in the minor leagues? And that test will arise at some point. I'm sure for this team. Well, well, that's an interesting thing because this year, this club has decided to rest players on a regular basis. I don't think we've ever seen that before. You know, we certainly, if you go back to 92, 93, you know, this, this team put a lineup up. Everybody in the world could put the lineup up. It we knew exactly who was going to hit where, who was going to play where. And it was going to be an everyday thing with this team. I don't know who's playing first base. I don't know who's playing second base. I'm not sure who's playing center field. It's kind of like script. It's kind of like scrub, Bob, you know, where you actually move bases. Well, you got five guys who play part time. You know, that is very that's very uncommon in the majors for a good team. Yes, but I think the reason they're doing that is because they feel that they have. Twenty five man depth. I mean, look at the bait, the situation at second base, for example, on any given day, you could have either Whit Maryfield, who's tearing the cover off the baseball. You could have Santiago Espinal, you know, the forgotten man on this roster, who was an all star last year, or you could have, or you could have Kevin Bizio if, you know, there's a right hand around the hill and you want to get a lefty bat in there. I mean, second base conceivably could have three different guys over three different games playing there. Sure, you could. And Bizio could play first if you need them to. He could play right field if you need them to. Maryfield can play in the outfield as well. So I think what John Schneider is doing is he sees that he doesn't have, you know, three or four bench guys who are not worthy major leaguers. He does have players on that bench who could conceivably on other organizations be starting players. And he's trying to move everybody in and out of the lineup and massaging that lineup every single day, which is why it's not like it was in 93 when it was the same nine every day. Well, that's the question I have is, you know, and I guess we can't tell right now because we're, you know, barely into me. But is this going to be effective? As it was 162 games, right? That's what you're asking, right? Does it work? Yeah. I mean, look, look at Brandon Belt, for example, I mean, Brandon Belt couldn't hit anything in the early part of the season. In part due to the fact he wasn't getting reps. And then all of a sudden he gets a little bit of playing time in Pittsburgh. And, you know, you see what he was doing all those years in San Francisco, you know, being a tough guy to get out and, you know, and getting, you know, and he's got extra base power. He doesn't run that well, but, you know, he can find the gaps and he can't hit it over the wall too. So, I mean, the way I see things is the record dictates to me how you form your lineup every day. And if this seems to be working for this club, I think you'll see this, this variety of lineups every single day. And who knows how long Vlad is going to be out with a bit of a risk problem. So, so whether or not that crops up tomorrow in Philadelphia and they, you know, they got a massage the lineup once again, we'll see. But it's not a bad problem to have. Think about that. And a good major league club with good bench players and good bench options is far better than a bunch of AAA scrubs who you hope never have to make an appearance in a ball game. Yeah, except if you look at championship teams, you know, we talked about the 92 93 blue Jays, you look to the championship teams. Name one that did this. Name one that had, you know, four positions that you didn't know on a given day who was going to play with where. No, no, but times have changed, right? I mean, well, yeah, times have changed, but, but, but that seems to be sort of a basic. I mean, the Iron Man is going to be 500 games now. It's not going to be 21. I mean, let's face it. How many, how many games a guy plays now and how you stay in the lineup on a consistent daily basis is. That's a different world in 2023 than it was in. Yeah, I sort of understand that. But, but, but you have to rotate a guy. I had a day off here and there. I'm sure I get that. Yeah. As an aside, go ahead, Jamie. Go ahead, sorry. You know, you may see Bob, you may see this change come July, August and into September. You know, when the team is is closer to, let's say, locking in a playoff position. I mean, based on what we're seeing now, this is a playoff team, whether that's a division winner or a while. Sure, I get that. I get that. Yeah, I agree. You may see more consistency in the lineup later in the summer. I think what Don Schneider is doing right now is playing around with the lineup that he's not necessarily set on because he has the opportunity to do that. He has the opportunity to match up bats, whether it's lefties versus righties, whatever it might be. And he's got that luxury of the early part of the season to be able to do it. But it wouldn't surprise me if by mid-August, you're seeing for the most part, the same nine guys running out there every single day. I see I would. I'd be surprised. I think that would only happen as a result of failure with this concept because July and August are, you know, they're the tough days. Right. That's when guys are more likely to get hurt and more likely to be tired, need a day off. And we've seen that historically in the past. You know, you try and get everybody ready for September. So July and August are days where you get days off. Well, this team is doing that in April. Yeah, but I think it's philosophical. I don't think it's because of injury concerns. What I'm thinking is, is in August as much as the weather turns spicy, guys need more time off their feet. If you're in a battle for, say, the division lead with, let's say, Tampa, who seems to be running away with it right now, you're not sitting, George Springer very often. Bo's not going to get off his feet very often. Vlad is going to play every day if he's healthy. Varsho is necessary, especially with the left-handed bat. You automatically have a sort of a hybrid of catchers, whether it's Janssen or Kirk, Whitmerryfield, the way things are going, should be playing every day. So the only way you're going to massage that lineup is with two or maybe three guys, I would think. It's amazing how quickly we take it from the bottom. It's amazing how quickly we take Matt Chapman for just... And I thought you mentioned Matt Chapman, right? We haven't mentioned the link in April. All he is is great. I watch one of those games in Boston. I was shocked to see him out of the lineup. What was going on there? And look who's playing third base when he's not there. It's like a Westman all who's got a tremendous glove, right? So now you see how it is possible to give a guy a day off every now and then, even though he was just named Player of the Month. Yeah, by the way, as a total aside, and watching the team play this weekend and see Belt hit the ball so well, do you think there's anything the fact that Belt's a National League player played in San Francisco, and he goes to Pittsburgh, a National League stadium, do you ever wonder that those kind of things happen that they feel more comfortable in those stadiums? That could be the case I used to think that, but now with interleague play, every player has seen every ballpark. So, I mean, that might have been a factor. Yeah. If I remember correctly, Shulman and Siddle were talking about the fact that Kiermeyer, who's been around forever, was playing in Pittsburgh for the first time in his career over the course of the weekend, which baffles me that a guy that's been around that long hasn't been everywhere yet. Yeah. Well, you know, we mentioned Bishette, and I think we got to give him props. Boy, is he having a fantastic season at the plate? It's like every time he comes up, you expect a base hit, usually the right field. Yeah. But who cares? You know, who cares where the base hit is? I, you know, I don't know that I've ever seen a guy as confident as he is, and as productive as he has been. I mean, he's hit some long balls, so it's not like they're all, you know, lollipops, but a lot of hard hit, you know, line drives and ground balls to the right side. It just, he's been, and he was so good in September last year. You know, is it a carryover? I don't know. But boy, he looks like the best player in baseball for the last two or three months of play. Isn't that something? You know, I turned to Caleb Joseph yesterday, and I said, when you think about it, and I know it's early, but this guy right now is on a Hall of Fame trajectory. I mean, he has, he has managed to put up offensive numbers at this point in his career that if sustained over 10 to 15 years, have Hall of Fame written all over them. And then Caleb turned, Caleb turned to me and said, and with that, all he has to do is be an average defender at short. And that's all he is. Well, and that's all he is. And then we had this conversation about him defensively and said, you know what? We haven't noticed lately. We haven't noticed. Both throw it into the stands in weeks, right? He is. He is actually, if you think about it, and I said this to Caleb, the only time we talk about him defensively is when he makes a glaring mistake. And in the early part of the year, that seemed to be frequently. We haven't had to talk about this kind of thing for weeks, it seems, because he seems to have locked things in. Defensively, I love watching the kid. I love watching the fact that you cannot defend him because we know how good he is hitting the ball to right field. We know he seems to be way more comfortable with two strikes than at any other time. And then in Boston, even though they lost all four of those games, he decides to start pulling the baseball. And the next thing you know, it's base hit to left, home run to left, ripped one off the monster to left. All of this hitting the ball to right field just disappeared for four days. I know, but it's still in him and it's what he does. And I sat there the other day and was wondering, I said, you know, I don't know, where would you pitch him? Like you're trying, you're trying defensively. He's a guy, he's a guy who you've got to concentrate on and you got to think about before every game. All right, where are we going to? You know, what do we want to do with him? You want to throw it low? He can hit it low. You want to throw it high? He'll go get it high. You want to throw it on the outside of the plate? Forget about it. It's a base hit. I don't know where you pitch him. Right. How about just walk him? That's what Sittle said when they had a couple of runners on and you might be right. He said, I would feel more comfortable putting him on base and taking my chances with Vladimir Guerrero Jr. You're right. But you know what? In order to walk him, you better throw it a long way outside. That's true. He's going to go get it. I can't believe we're swinging those first two pitches. Can't believe we're talking about walking guys in May, though. I mean, come on. Well, that's how good he is, right? Yeah. I mean, he's going to the way things are going. He'll lead the league and hits for the third straight year. That is quite something. That is definitely something. And it's something we don't talk enough about. I think we don't pay enough attention to the fact that, you know, this guy really can hit. Really can hit. I suppose that's the comfort of the three year deal, Jamie. He he he freely admits he feels a lot more comfortable. He knows that he doesn't have to think about his value, at least for three more years. You know, and he's a kid. He's a fascinated kid. I spoke to his father about this. He really does. I mean, you hear this cliche about people who live and breathe the things that they do. Baseball is everything to bow. I had this great conversation with his dad last year about his commitment to the game. And I get to the ballpark reasonably early. And every time I do, there he is in a cut off T-shirt, taking ground balls short, trying to get better defensively. There he is in the cage on days when he really doesn't have to be doing it every single day, but he would just much rather be there. His dad tells me he doesn't really worry about a personal life and going out and dating and doing all that stuff because he's just too consumed. With trying to be the best possible baseball player he can be. And that's pretty evident. I think if you watch the games with a keen eye, it's pretty evident that that is the way he carries himself. You should know this, but what kind of money is he making now? Well, three years and 33 million. I think he's only making, it's one of those back loaded deals. So I think this year's salary is actually three and a half million. And then he's up to I think 15 next year and 17 the year after that before free agency. I see. The way he's playing right now, he's a $30 million player. Yes, he is. That's a three year bargain they got there, but it's going to cost them. I mean, think about this, right? Oh, bow in three years is going to be very expensive. Fladdy's getting really expensive. If Alec Manoa can, you know, go back to being the pitcher that he's proven to be over a year plus prior to this season. You're looking at a hundred million plus to get his name on a contract. I mean, things are starting to get really expensive around this team and it's going to be fascinating to see who stays, who goes, who gets free signed. I mean, look, Matt Chapman would be. It would be wonderful to think that that guy could return, but the way he's playing these days, his, his, his ask is going to be tremendous at the end of this year. And I'm not sure. Well, I'm quite certain he won't fit into, you know, the budget that they're probably setting for themselves because they've got too many other guys that need to be taken care of. Well, somebody, somebody's going to be out. Oh, yeah, whether it's him or not, I, you know, that's going to be a hard one, but somebody's going to give him a lot of money to complete complete third base for them. No question. And I guess the blue Jays will have to decide based a lot on what they've got coming up through the system. And there, I gather there are not a lot of star players like knocking on the door. No, there are not. And a third base. I mean, I don't know if they project Addison Varger as being a third baseman. He's that kid that turned a lot of heads with his power with his power last year and in spring training. I don't know of a player right now who is knocking on the door at that position. I mean, I know they could, you know, unless they go and trade for a third baseman, they could always shift Santiago Espinal into that role if if Chapman departs. It all depends on how they they envision the lineup construction, obviously. You know, the fascination about this team and this sport is that the moment we say, well, you know, they've got a budget. They're not going to be able to manage it. You know, there are 29 other teams that spend money like water. I mean, and everybody other than other than Kansas City and Pittsburgh and Oakland and Oakland, but everybody else spends by that and the J's can spend money. It's not as if they're not in a position. They're there. They're what in the number four market in North America, they have the largest regional. Regional area of any of the major league baseball teams. They have a tremendous television deal. If if any $300 million on their stadium and but yeah, but that's that's a different budget, Bob. As a different budget, I get it. No, but look at John, the way. Look at how many people like that place as a as is there an empty seat out there. Has there been one at the Rogers Center sold out? I haven't seen one. Yeah, by the way, it's sold out every game. Yeah, what's that $20 a head? I mean, look, there are midweek games. There were there were some empty seats, but I've been real. Not many of them. I've been I've been really pleasantly surprised with how many people are turning out to watch this ball club. And remember, they if I'm not mistaken, they've crossed over the luxury tax threshold for the first time. Yes, they have. I mean, they're going to be paying some money to right into into that kitty for the first time. And that's something they've been they've been low to do for years and years and years. I tell you what, though, when you think that they started those 10 games on the road, was the stadium got, you know, polished up again. And now they're on this extended road trip. When do you ever I mean, home games? When do they show up soon? Well, yeah, like Friday, my son came to me and said, Dad, I want to go to a ball game soon. And I said, well, you got 10 to choose from beginning on Friday. So you know, let me know. And I always see, I keep one of those fridge magnets ever present and all the home games. They still have those. They still have those magnets. Oh, are you kidding me? That's how I go about my day is I look at the fridge magnet every morning and June, July and August are loaded with blue games. I mean, there are just so many home games because they played so many on the road. So great. Oh, I know. Exactly. I'll listen, we got to take a break. We're going to talk more about the Toronto Blue Jays and baseball in general. Jamie Campbell is so with us. We'll be back after these messages. We all know how to use the Internet, but most of us don't know how the Internet uses us. So instead of figuring out how I can protect myself from the unknown, that is the worldwide web. I just got Nord VPN to do it for me. First and foremost, what's a VPN? I'm going to talk about Nord VPN. I'm going to talk about Nord VPN. I'm going to talk about Nord VPN. I'm going to talk about Nord VPN. 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You can't have him start every fifth day because we just, we had seen what happens when that happens. And this is a guy who's five and oh, you know, on top of the day, you know, we're on top of the league. Is he already is pretty good too? It's in the three something, you know, what the turnaround has been, you know, remarkable. Nothing short of remarkable by this guy. How concerned are you about Manoa Jamie? Not as much. Not as much as some. I don't think I think Alex going to be a work in process or in progress. My opinion is one, he's never going to be, you know, that dominant swing and miss, you know, 97, 98 that Kevin Gossman is in that ridiculous splitter. So that's never going to be Alec Manoa. Manoa is going to have to be one of those thinking man's pitchers who's got an array of pitches and an obvious conviction as well. I mean, and here's a guy who stands on the mound. It doesn't feel that he should ever lose, which is, which is a great trade to have quite obviously. I don't really worry about him, but, but I also know that, you know, he's working through something right now in part due to the fact that after a year and change, the major leagues have have a good sense of who he is and have a good sense of what to expect. So now they've made that adjustment to him. And I think this year is his time to learn how to adjust to what they're trying to do. Yeah, I think you're right. The thing that concerns me though, is velocity, because this is the guy who last year was 94, 95, 96 on a regular basis. And now he's 91, 92 on a regular basis. But all the time though, right? Not all the time. He sits around 92, 93, but you'll notice as he gets into second, third and fourth inning, he can get it up to 95. Right? Well, it's there. But he was throwing 95 all the time before, and he's not anymore. Why not? Don't know. Don't know. And I said, you know, I said to Caleb the other day, it's amazing to look at a guy that has built the way he's built and then compare him physically to say Jordan Romano, who's taller and leaner and can throw 97 without thinking about it. And Alec Manoa physically looks like a guy who should be able to touch 98, 99 without a problem, but doesn't know, right, which is why, right, which is why he's got to be, he's got to be a speed changer the way Chris Bassett is. He's got to be a guy who's getting greater depth on his slider, which was a problem, right? The slider was flattening out and it was running into the barrel of whether it was a righty or a lefty, depending on where it was ending up. And that was an issue. And then he's got that two seam fastball that runs in on lefties, but leaks out to the barrel if it doesn't have enough of a dive in it. And that was an issue too. So a lot of it was the execution of the pitches was the problem and not just the pitches themselves. Yeah. Well, I mean, look, I quite frankly, I love the the the array of offerings from the guy. I mean, he's got, he's got two seam, he's got the four seam, he's got the slider, throws a change up every now and then. I mean, he's got some tools. It's just executing those tools. And you hear, you know, especially the manager post game, especially after a loss, talk about pitch selection and execution, the way he did with, I think it was Zack Pop and that Seattle series, where Zack pop through a breaking ball to Cal Raleigh, who doesn't have the ability to hit a fastball, but can definitely mash your off speed stuff. So it was just a poor selection of pitches. And, you know, a lot of times the performances of Minoa come down to not only selection, but execution of those pitches. Yeah. Could he be in a situation like Kacuchi was last year, a classic case of overthinking? That's a great question. I don't, I don't see that yet. I don't think so. Again, this is just from this is from my vantage point of of not having stood in a major league batter's box. That's all. Remember that, right? I'd be very careful about about what I offer an opinion on, but from what I can see his stuff, which played last year and in the early part or the latter part of 2021 isn't playing as well as it used to because people have seen it. And they've studied it and they've sat in that batter's box waiting for it. And they have a better game plan in 2023 than they did when it came up two years ago. Has there any, you know, we've talked a bit about, about, about guys who have underperformed this year, but is there an underperformance that concerns you? I mean, it's Bijio's underperformance. Yeah. You know, the guys to 20 hit her. How the 100 kerks was for a time. He's coming around, but he missed a good portion of spring training. Yeah. I don't know. I think he might have gained a little bit weight wise. I don't know that for sure. And, you know, sometimes I'm told that can affect swing mechanics. The running games a bit of a problem, at least stopping the running game seems to be a bit of an issue. And you know, when they, when they started that series in Pittsburgh, the pirates were far and away. The leaders and installed bases in the major leagues. But it didn't seem, you know, they, they seemed to do a better job of holding the runners. In that series, mind you, they lost their leadoff bay, leadoff hitter Bay to an injury. And the first game, if I'm not mistaken, he was kind of the, you know, the, the, the, the greater threat of all of them. But I don't, I don't know. I don't see one singular performance that, that is of concern at this point. Do you actually on the, on the Kirk Janssen situation, do you notice a difference in the personality of the club in between one of the two catchers behind the plate? No, because I think there's faith in both of them. Yeah. They're both clearly the styles are very different, right? Yeah. You know, Kirk's, Kirk's proven to be a pretty darn good hitter and can spray the baseball. Danny's more of a, a pole hitter with power. And you know, he can surprise you with how far he can hit the baseball. But you know, he also has those, those stretches where he'll go over 10, because he can't get around on one. I think they're both very highly valued as receivers. And if I'm listening to the guys that sit beside me, most nights, Janssen's really improved defensively. You're not seeing these breaking pitches get away from him that are in the dirt the way they have in the past. And I think he's really, he's really made drastic improvements on his ability to block and get down on pitches. So I think they're both very highly respected in that clubhouse and, and, and certainly valued by the guys who are on the mound. I tell you one thing that drives me a little crazy too is Bassett calling his own pitches. How do you feel about, how do you feel about that? Well, he's gotten into the rhythm of it. And, and remember that, that first game he pitched in St. Louis. And every time you'd see him on the mound, he was busy pressing some button on his wrist and too, and too late in getting it sent. Yeah. But that, that's not a problem anymore. I call, I love watching him now. And, and I think it was James McCann who caught him in New York last year had told Caleb that it will take him five starts before these catchers get used to and comfortable with this multitude of offerings this guy has. I really like watching him. You know the, the miles per hour difference in his outing in Pittsburgh between his soft stuff and his hard stuff was 25 miles an hour. He was throwing, he was, 93, 94 at times and, and as low as 70 and 71 miles an hour on breaking stuff. And, and I just love watching that kind of thing. I just think you think, I think he's thinking too much in a especially with a 15 second clock ticking away. He's got to think about what he wants to throw and what he should be throwing. Um, isn't I think I don't disagree with, I don't disagree with the earlier starts. I'm not seeing that as much anymore. In fact, you know, one thing that is noticeable is how pissed he gets when the batter takes a timeout and he jumps off the back of the mound and goes for this long stroll and stares out into the outfield because he knows exactly how much time he has to get back up onto the mound. He already knows what pitch he wants to throw anyway. And he's figured out this method of timing it out. I, I really enjoy watching him. Yeah. I think we're going to see more and more with the, with the technology now. I think we're going to see more and more pitchers do that and call their own pitches like that. I just think that that's inevitable. I really do between the, between the clock and the fact that you can go and, you know, hit a couple of taps and call the slider. Look, I think, I think the reason I, I don't think it was done before was because teams wouldn't let pitchers do it. They said, no, it's up to the catcher. The catcher is a guy who's got the time, who's got the thought process. He, he, he should be calling the pitches. You're, you're jealous to throw the pitch. I think that that was the philosophy has been the philosophy forever in baseball. Now maybe this guy changes that philosophy. I don't know. Yeah. But I'm still not convinced. You know what I have noticed? And I'm sure you guys have seen this too based on this pitch clock system that's been introduced is the pitchers are exhausted. Yes. And there was a start. I think it was in either New York or Houston. But I can't remember which where second or third inning and Bassett was breathing heavily on the mound because the tempo has picked up so much that it appeared. It sort of caught him by surprise how much exertion was required to stand up there, throw a pitch, get the ball back and throw another one within 15 seconds. And it's, it's pretty, it's pretty clear. Yeah. And now there's this suggestion that these, all these pitchers are going down with injuries is because they're not used to this, this repetition as, as quickly as it's happening. And I'll speak from a viewer standpoint. These two hour and 20 minute games, I'm loving them quite frankly. And that, that has nothing to do with, you know, I get to get out early and maybe see my kids before they go to bed at night. It has everything to do with man, this game just moves at a pace that is really entertaining. Being your seed early. That's the key, right? Yeah. And by the way, before we let you go, how's your health? Things are great. I'm on a brand new form of treatment as of last week. And so far so good. And I'm about to turn, what, 56 years old in a couple of weeks. So I never, I never cared about birthdays until I got a cancer diagnosis. And now I celebrate every one of them. Good. Right. Because my ultimate goal is to, is to celebrate number 85 one day. Well, you look good. You look good. Thanks. Happy 85th birthday, by the way, because we won't be here. Hold on. Speak for yourself. If and when you might, if and when you get there, no, you might not be here as in on the here, but you'll be here. Oh, no. No, you know what I mean. I'll be here on this planet. I'll be, I'll be, well, I'll be in a box somewhere underneath the surface of the planet. Oh, goodness. In any event. Good to see you. Thanks a lot for taking time for us. Always appreciate it. You know that Bob, John, it's great to speak with both of you. Be well. Okay, pal. Talk to you soon. That's Jamie Campbell with us. 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That's code Bobcast 50 and factor meals.com slash Bobcast 50 to get 50% off of your first box. Okay, we are back. McCallen and Shannon. I thanks again to Jamie Campbell for being with us. You called them my hockey team. Yeah, your team. That's not. I don't know why you'd say that. Well, you're from Toronto. You know, you're not from Toronto. I live in Toronto. Your career, you know, was really, you know, designed around the success of the Blue Jays and the demise of the Maple Leafs. It was not it was not the demise of the Maple Leafs that did me any good whatsoever. It never it always helped the ratings though. And when the Leafs were bad, it helped the ratings, didn't it? Did it? I don't know. I got no idea. I can tell you this. If they've been good, I think they would. If they've been good during that period on a consistent basis, I think the ratings would have been better. But bad, I don't know. Well, I'll tell you what, they've been, you know, they were all played in the Tampa series. We both agreed to that and they have been outplayed again in the in this series each game. But not, you know, but in my opinion, not as much. I think they played better. Well, they've, you know, they've actually, they've actually faced a tougher, a better goaltender too. Let's be honest. Surgae, Brabovsky, yes, I've, yes, has been better than Andre Vasilewski was. Look at the question is really to analyze this series because this series, it appears is over. Really the analysis should start on. What do you do now? Have you had enough with this group? Have there been enough playoff losses with this group to finally say, all right, we're going to change it. Can you come back with the same cast of characters next year? Because if you want to cop, you would, but you're not, doesn't look like they're going to win a cup. It doesn't look like they might not win another game. Do you think they were so satisfied in winning that first series, getting that monkey out of their back? I can't imagine. You can imagine either. Here can I, but it certainly looks like that. Well, I don't, I think they're, they're playing crummy. Yeah. I don't think they're playing up the middle of the ice enough. There's too much along the board. I think Florida has pushed them out there though, Bob. I mean, Florida's done a magnificent job of keeping the foot under the net. You're supposed to, you're supposed to be a good enough team, John, that you can play where you want to play. Do what you want to do. And they, what they want to do apparently is shoot the puck in along the boards. And they're not very good in getting the off the board. I don't think they have any choice but to shoot the puck and, and, and, like, dump and chase. Florida has really clogged up the middle and there's no way they're going to be able to do what they did in the middle of the regular season, skate the puck over the blue line and dipsy doodle and look great. They're just not built for that. How did Florida suddenly become this great team in playing up the middle? Is that Florida in their first round series against Boston? Yeah, they did. They clogged up the middle? Absolutely. Absolutely. They clogged up the middle. Yeah. Yeah. And it, well, if this was, if Paul Murray's figured this out, he's brilliant. Well, they've obviously done something right in the world. Well, that all year. No, but you, you know, as well as I do, when you have new, a new coach and you have new players, you know, you don't galvanize on the first day of practice and, you know, the first day of October, you play great. And on obviously they have been, the last 45 to 50 days, they've been a great team. They have been a great team, you know, ever since Paul Murray's gave them heck at Scotia Bank. Obviously they've been better. They've been winning more. Yeah. You know, it all comes back to gold. It all comes back to what you talk about consistently. And that's gold tending. It all comes back to gold tending. But Rosky has given them such confidence. They can do things. They can move the puck. They, you know, Florida defensively, Aaron Eckblad, you know, has done some really solid things. They have some younger, they have a lot of young guys that we've never heard of, Bob, like the regular, regular hockey fans never heard of because they play in Florida that are playing out of their minds right now. And then you add Matthew Kachuk, Sam Bennett, Anthony DeClaire, who played a great game in game three. This team right now is fearless. And the other team is fearful. Well, that much I'll give you the Toronto Police Top four, whatever they are. The core four have done nothing. Nothing. And this is a team that has quite honestly, for most of the season, most of the year, it's been the performance of the top four that has been the key for the Toronto Police. It's the difference between winning and losing. And these guys have done nothing in these playoffs. Nothing. You mean in this series, in this series? Yes, exactly. Yeah, not in the playoffs. And they, because they play pretty well. They play pretty well. They did a pretty good job in Tampa. So, but three games against Florida, they've done nothing. No, you're right. And that's the problem. The guy, I, you know, we call, I think he's one of the MVP all season long, and that's Mitch Marner. I think he had an unbelievable. He was. He was an elite player in the regular season. And I don't know how he was horrible in game three. Yeah. I just don't know how. He took away, he made the wrong move, you know, but they've targeted it. Literally, everything he did was wrong. Yeah. Well, we'll see. Now they, and now they have 72 hours to stew about it. Game four isn't until Wednesday. So we got to go. Well, we'll see what happens on Wednesday. My guess is it's the end of the season for the Toronto Police and we can start making plans for the future. And those, those plans are going to be pretty dramatic, I think. We hope you'll join us tomorrow for John Shannon Bob McCown. Have a nice evening. Goodbye everybody. Bye. And, we'll see you in the next video.