Reacting To The PGA Championship At Oak Hill W/ Ian Leggatt & Richard Zokol

This is the Bob McCallen podcast and I'm just brought to you by Bed Rivers, download the Bed Rivers online casino and sportsbook app today. I know what I did on the weekend. I watched a lot of golf. I suspect you did the same thing Shannon. Yeah, I did. Golf hockey basketball. I watched it all. It's the way to go. You know, it's a great time of year. I mean, I was so excited for Corey on Corey Connors on Saturday. So was I till that shot in the bunker. And then he became the phantom at the old kill. Yeah. It disappeared on Sunday. No, I get it. Yeah. Well, usually we talk to our golf guys before an event. We're going to talk to them today. And we're going to do it after because it's just and we picked a good day because there's a hell of a lot of stories. Sure, we're Ian Lager and Richard Zokal will join us when we come back after these messages. Hi, this is Bob McCallen for BedRivers.com. Hey, if you're looking for a sportsbook or casino app, you should check out the Bed River Sports and Casino app today. Play all of your favorite casino games for real money anywhere and anytime. Plus get in the action with each sports game with hundreds of sports betting options and get ready to feel like a VIP because you'll earn both loyalty level points and bonus store points on every real money wager you make. You must be 19 plus available in Ontario only. Please play responsibly. If you have questions or concerns about your gambling or someone close to you, contact Connex Ontario at 1-866-531-2600 or speak to an advisor free of charge. BedRivers.com. Well, as John pointed out earlier, we usually do our golf segments prior to a championship but chose this week to do it on the day after the PGA. And so Zokal and Lager are with us as per usual. The tournament was played in Rochester, New York at Oak Hill. I played the golf course several times. It's one of my favorite golf courses and one of the toughest golf courses I think I've ever played. Now, I know that Richard, you've played there. You played there in what? 89 US Open? Yeah, 1989 US Open when Curtis won. Played with all four rounds. Played with Jumbo Zaki and that was an interesting story in itself but don't want to get pulled off our point. Yeah, see the edgolos. Well, you know, it's funny to say that. It's funny to say that because as editor of this Japanese magazine, because I played with the saw on the third round at the US Open there, he was bugging me and saying, did you see him cheat? And I'm going, look, I did not see him cheat. So get off my back. If I saw him cheat, that's another story, but I did not see any breach of the rules by Jumbo, is Aki. Just to work. I vaguely recall that. But what did they allegedly did? Well, he was well, he had a has or had a reputation of fudging the rules. Oh, yeah. I go to have some stories on that, I'm sure, but basically what he would do typically in the US Open type of thing, you'd when he drove it in the rough, you'd pull it as, you know, three wood and pat the grass down as he's taken and preparing to hit the shot. Then he'd go back and hit a five arm and technically improving his lie. So he was there was someone out for him and wanted to out him as a as a tutor. And you know, and obviously if I saw him do that, I would have reported him, but he didn't see him do anything. They had a big one there, you know, Bob, if you remember the US Open with Greg Norman threatened to go, they actually, he actually went after him out on the golf course. If you remember that, that was a chin to cock and, but I played with him in Japan and witnessed it. He cheats. And he does exactly what Soak's talking about, you know, he'll go in there with woods tapped down behind the ball. And next thing you know, the thing comes rifling out onto the green with a seven iron, you know, nuts. Yeah. Yeah. Hey, well, let me ask you guys, we, you know, here we are. It's the end of May. The PGA is now in May, as opposed to August. Are we going to the weather wasn't that great? We had frost delays. There was a little overcast. It's a little chilly. Are we going to see the PGA move to southern climbs more than we are any other? I don't know about that. I mean, I like it personally. I mean, the elements play, you know, some form. It did not much on the weekend. Well, I guess you could when you talk about the soft conditions. Well, we're only saving. Yeah, that's going to happen anywhere. Yeah, that's only saving grace. I mean, score would have been even far if that place was firm. But, you know, I kind of like it. I don't know about Zoke. I like, I mean, the PGA tour, if you watch the calendar and how it moves across the, you know, continental U.S. it always follows the good weather. So I like it personally. I mean, the only, the only, you know, potential issue here is that, you know, that you got fairly lucky is that, you know, Oak Hill was, was ready to play. I mean, if they had, you know, snow and horrible spring conditions, the golf course could have been an embarrassment to the membership in the fact that it wouldn't have been ready. But it was ready. I thought the course of the members, the guys playing complimented how great it was. I've got a couple members here at the Gore Center members there. They said the golf course never looked better. So I think it played well other than it missed out on the firm conditions. Sure. I agree. I totally agree. When the PGA used to be in August, it was a real bugger playing in the South. I mean, Houston, Alabama, you know, all those southern states, it was, it's really hot. So I think they've opened their ability to play all over North America in this state. With the date change, you with this date in this date in May rather than August. So they have more options, not in America, well, in the United States. Exactly. It's a better date. And, you know, elements or elements, it's part of the game. I like the order too. I think it gives the PGA championship a little more precedences that it would always used to be kind of the former major. Now it's really another major. And I think it really, you know, elevates the status in sort of the four majors. Yeah, it does. It's an improvement for the PGA of America playing in second position of the second of the four majors rather than kind of being kind of what they used to call, you know, glory's last stand, the final major of the year. Yeah, it was almost like, and I always thought the PGA was like an after, almost an after thought that it didn't have its status as a real major because of the August date. And now it does. Now it's a very important tournament, I think. Yeah. It could have played in a bigger role actually Bob. When you think about it, Brooks Keptka got a closed out at Augusta. And I, you know, I know if another player is ever going to come along like Tiger, but we always looked at him winning the Masters and can he win all four majors one year. It was almost a little bit like earth racing, you know, and but, you know, Brooks Keptka could have captured the Masters and then wins the PGA. Now it brings, you know, that conversation in of someone actually winning all four majors in one year. Well, what do we think about? What do we think about Keptka in general? I mean, obviously he's a great player. He's one one five majors now. That's yeah, that's that's pretty good. Fantastic. I'm not. I'm just going to go off all the fame. Oh, ban him from that too. Well, but is he a pop? Do you think he's a popular player on the tour? I don't buy his peers. Yeah, he's quite popular. I mean, he rubs some people the wrong way, but he one thing he didn't do, like what Phil and others have done Patrick Reed as an example is he, him and Dustin have not offended their, you know, on their personal level, they have not offended their peers. They've kept a good relationship and that's serving them very well right now. Like Brooks Keptka is the consummate lone alpha predator. He is going to live and die as an alpha predator. And you know, the fascinating thing that we watched it to unfold at the Masters when he was doing his Brooks Keptka thing, you know, he had that lead going into the fun around. He spoke about how he tried to not lose the tournament rather than when it he learned, he adapted and then when he got into the same situation at this, this major championship, he took on that he had full freedom to pursue and he got the job done like an absolute lone alpha predator. It's very impressive stuff. Yeah, I think too. When you look at it, I think that, you know, what he's been through over injuries, I think that first major and opportunity to win, you know, he's really kind of going to Zoke's point for the last three to four years, just literally trying to survive his, his persona, his ego has been wounded in the fact that physically he could not perform to his mental, you know, perception of himself, which is damaging. So he became, you know, if you want to call him a figment of his own personal belief of who he was. So back healthy, he became the person and he realized the issues that, you know, kind of came about at Augusta and he took care of it. He called it. He called it on Sunday going in. You know, it's funny, I was mentioning to someone, you know, I played with Tiger a few times and everybody always talked about he's already beat you by two shots before he puts a T in the ground every round because he already knows he's not going to make any mistakes. And I think that Brooks Kept go when he calls that out, he puts himself out in front of everybody, especially in the light with live and kind of that, you know, dark horse that he that all those particular players have become, is he called it out. But the better part of it is just like Tiger does, he actually owned it and took care of business on Sunday. Have we, are we minimizing the guys who've gone over to live now? Because we don't see them every week. We really, you know, I don't follow the live tour at all. Has their image long term image and history, do we think that it's being affected by the fact that they play on the live instead of on the PGA tour? Like when we think of the great players, you know, in the future, when we think of the great players of this era, will these guys be mentioned? Or will they, would they go down a step or two because they're on live and not on the PGA tour? I think it, what do you guys think? I think it depends on what they do in majors like this. So prior to this year, you know, last year filled in play and now this year, the thought was what's going to eat with US Open going to do? What's the PGA? What the masters are they, what are they going to do with these players? So at the start of the year, they decided, okay, if they've earned their place in it, they can play. Let's, you know, that's a good rationale. Now that they've come in and the masters, Phil Plet finishes, you know, as well as he did, he's got his podium, he's on his stump, he's starting barking again and Brooks did what he did. And now they've earned their spot. If their Brooks is performing, having won this PGA and doing what he did at the masters, they're going to earn their spots in it. But if they didn't play well, you know, they can be forgotten about. But now it's a different story. They've gone down a different path and now Liv has a strong perspective. They gained a lot of value. Basically what's happening now we're in this discussion is are these Liv players eligible or should they play in the Ryder Cup? So a lot of evolution, a lot of things are changing rapidly and it's fascinating to discuss. Well, let me ask you this guys. Would the fact that you can play on the Liv Tour and play in the four major tournaments, is that something the PGA Tour was trying to lobby to make sure that they didn't participate in those things and that's changed the whole complexion Ian? Yeah, I think that's exactly what they wanted. I mean, the PGA Tour took this as, you know, a complete threat. You know, we've talked about this at Nauseum and don't need to regurgitate it. You know, they wanted them completely blocked out of everything and like Zoke says, it's going to be a very, very interesting sit down. Zach Johnson being a former member of the board of the PGA Tour is captain of the Ryder Cup. Now he's got to sit back and there is absolutely, in my mind, no chance that he can overlook Brooks' Cup get, you know, for the Ryder Cup. The Ryder Cup being run by the PGA of America as well. So, you know, I also want to just touch on, you know, Bob's last comment, you know, and kind of following up with Zoke. Peter Thompson did not play on the PGA Tour. I mean, Peter Thompson will go down in history as one of the greatest players to ever play the game. So I think when you look at the past, how important majors are, nobody could tell you how many Australian opens or other European Tour events Peter Thompson won. But you can, you definitely know his British Open record. So when you look at these particular players, if they have to remain banned by the PGA Tour and the DP World Tour, it's purely going to be built on how they perform in major championships. But I think it gives credibility to these players now. You know, when you look at it, I think it was what seven or eight guys from Liv finished in the top 20 in the tournament this week. So, I mean, the whole persona and the messaging that the PGA Tour and other, you know, journalists that support tour or against Liv, however you want to put it, that Liv is an exhibition is a joke. So I mean, these guys are still great players. You put them around a park and a lot and put flags in the ground of Brooks County is still going to try to win. So, you know, I think it's going to be a very interesting conversation going forward with the PGA Tour. It does with these guys. We're not done yet, by the way. We're not done. Let's see how many majors, Liv players win this year. Well, that's true. You still got the US Open, the British Open to come. Yeah. Where are we? You know, we haven't talked much about the Liv Tour and maybe this is the wrong form, but where are we with them? It's been quiet the last couple of months, has it not? Well, yes, it's been pretty quiet except for the Masters and now the PGA where the Liv players have really performed well. And it's obviously right now the big stinky fish on the table is, you know, are they going to allow like Dustin or Brooks? And is it hypocrisy? Is there a hypocrisy notion here because maybe, you know, the American Ryder Cup team wouldn't want Phil on the team or a Patrick Reed on the team, but they would want a Dustin or Brooks. Sure. Now, it's really an interesting thing. We watched Brandel Shambly and Brad Fax and have a bit of a discussion at it. It was and it should be discussed because I'm of the opinion too that these players shouldn't have their cake and eat it as well. You know, they lost their privileges and even though they may be members, their members not in good standing and they've reached the bylaws and we watched the DP World Tour. They're a little further down the court case because they've gone to arbitration and they've imposed fines and suspensions. And because of that, the majority of those DP World Tour players that do play on live, they've rescinded their membership. So avoid like Ian Poulter was was fined over a hundred thousand euros because of his suspension and so forth. So these things are, you know, does the PGA tour and the PGA of America want to kind of support the DP World? Because if now all of a sudden they choose to invite Brooks into the Ryder Cup, is that going to be a bit of a slap in the face to the DP World who cannot because they've rescinded their memberships and they won't be able to pick and choose their European players for the Ryder Cup team? So there is going to be a lot of discussion going on here. I do not disparage anyone who chooses to go and cross the line and go to live. But there are consequences. They are members of an organization that is suing the PGA tour. I think that's a problem. So there's it's going to be a difficult decision on what the PGA and the PGA tour are going to do as it relates to the Ryder Cup. It's going to be fascinating to watch. Well, one of the one of the issues for me it becomes, you know, right now live is how many tournaments do they have this year? 14 something like that. Yeah, technically these guys could play on the PGA tour and the live tour simultaneously. So they could play six, eight, 10, 12, who knows PGA tour events a year in addition to live like that is it being contemplated right now. The PGA tour isn't thinking about letting them play on those, but should they? Will they? You know, what's the future look like in the next few years? What do you think? Let go. Ian. You still with us? Yeah. Yeah, got me. Can you hear me? Yep, we can. Yeah, I mean, I'm the opposite as though. You know, I understand the bylaws and everything. I think there's a place for both to operate. And the reason why I say that I like the fact that the players are getting paid to play. And I think that that should be. By the way, the PGA tour is doing that now. So, you know, but I, you know, I just think it's better for the game of golf. I think that, you know, guys want to go to live, you know, just for this sample. Let's just say they, you know, they want to cut back their schedules. I think you had a big problem now. And I think you're going to see more guys go that, you know, let's just talk about John Rong, for instance, here's a perfect example. Rumors are out there. $50 million going to be going to live. Why wouldn't a guy play for $4 million first prize every week get paid a couple hundred million dollars to sign with the league and still play all four majors? Right. John Rong, as long as the exemptions stay in place, can do that. Now, there's been Andrew Schofle's of the world. The, you know, sort of, you know, if you want to do some of the greater players, Ian Poulters, for instance, I mean, they have no exemption status into major championships unless they tee it up in the qualifying for the US Open or the British Open. So, but these guys do. John Rong can play every single major for the next 10 years and play the Masters so he can't walk up 18 anymore. So I mean, he's got an opportunity. He could just say, I'll take the 250. I'm going to play 14 tournaments and play my four majors. And I'm still going to have an opportunity to do what we just talked about with Peter Thompson, the credibility and the validity of your career based on major championships. So that's going to happen. Well, I think for a lot of people, the layman, the lay golfer, the difference between the PGA of America and the PGA Tour. Can you, I mean, does that make a difference to what we're talking about with the Ryder Cup? Does that make a difference when we talk about other things, Ian? What do you think? Yeah, well, absolutely. I mean, Zilk, tell you about this too, I mean, the President's Cup was created purely as if you want to call it a competition to try to create an event that was similar to the Ryder Cup. Right. The five largest grossing events in professional golf are not owned by the PGA Tour. All four majors in the Ryder Cup. Okay. Right. The other half of the year has nothing to do with any of those events outside the fact that they pretty much supply the field. And this is how you get on those, that you, it's world golf ranking points and you get world golf points by playing on the PGA Tour. So I just think there's room for both. I would love to see it. I like the format. We can debate that too. I like to shock and start it. I like the team. And I watch it. I legitimately do watch it. I think the TV quality is getting better. It's fun to watch the way it's like actually watching a sporting event. So if you haven't had an opportunity to watch a live event, irrespective of, you know, what you believe Tour players playing 54 holes with no cut and a shotgun start sounds a little crazy, even as you say it. But I think it's kind of cool. But you know, it's going to be, you know, that chaos that has created with live is, you know, tenfold now with Brooks Kepta winning the PGA Championship. So also too is people, to your question, John, most people just say PGA and they think of PGA Tour. Right. The PGA of America and the PGA Tour are two different governing bodies. The PGA Tour broke away from the PGA of America in 1968 because the PGA, they wanted to be a separate entity. And then at that time, there was value in the PGA Tour. They got Jack Nick was Gary, player, Lee Trevino. And there was no doubt that it needed to go and separate itself. At that time, the Ryder Cup, it was, it had no value. In fact, it was a liability. So the players on the PGA Tour side didn't want that asset. They chose not to take it. So it kept ownership under the PGA of America. They, so the PGA of America and the European Tour own the Ryder Cup. They split it 50-50. But as Lego was talking about, the assets that are the value of the American side are the PGA Tour players. So as such, that's how it's evolved. But it's more of a joint venture between the PGA of America because as Lego said, the assets that, and the main important assets are the players on the American side that play against the, what is now the DP World Tour. So those two entities are the kind of, the rules and governing body of each private membership organization that make the bylaws on who's going to play. And I'm of the opinion that all membership organizations, if you want to get the benefits of the organization that you belong to, you need to be a member in good standing. If you don't, you don't, the consequences of going over, you chose them. That's just the way it is. I know that you can do a shotgun as LIV does because they only have what 48 or whatever number of players out there. You can't really do that in a tournament with 156 or whatever. Or can you? Like, will we see the PGA Tour adopt the LIV model of shotgun starts? No, I don't think I see that. I say that because, you know, on, I guess, Saturday, I turned on the television 738, the clock in the morning. And it was the event was on and they were doing television of it. And it ran until seven o'clock at night. I mean, this was a 12 hour television event, which I guess is fine for the golf channel. But the truth of the matter is that's a long time to watch golf. Yeah, but Bob, as you, as you know, they, they carve it up so many different ways. In the United States, there's over that 12 hour period, it's on three different channels. Well, I get that, John, but still. But in the end, it becomes a monetary issue. I mean, I want, you know, if I'm ESPN and I eat and I run ESPN and ESPN plus, I need six hours. So I'm going to pay for six hours and then the remaining goes to CBS. Well, the market never lies. If there's a demand to see all that, right, and there's eyeballs watching it, then it works. But if eyeballs aren't watching it, that'll go away. But yeah, you can't do a shotgun with, you know, the 75 guys that make the cut or 80 guys can't do it. Yeah, you look at it for next year. You're kind of probably a comedy just about everybody. Well, you want the drama of, you know, the challenge of the shotgun start is you don't want the winner to finish on the, you know, on the seventh whole type of thing. You want the situation where we watched this past week where on the weekend, Corey Connors was in the hunt, Victor Hoblin, Brooks, kept going. You create a difficult situation where they, each person had to handle it. It created the drama. It added significantly to the value that you just couldn't capture well in a, in a shotgun start. I don't disagree with you, but you know, is that negatively impacting live? Who does a shotgun start? Whose winner of a tournament may finish on six? Like, I didn't. Yeah, that doesn't really, well, that doesn't actually happen because they repair going into the last round. I mean, the winner couldn't end up finishing on, you know, 15 or 16, but they're not going to be finishing on six or seven. Okay. You know, and when you talk about it, like you just, you press the button exactly what they're trying to do. As a fan, you go out there and for four hours, you can see every single player in the field. You can stand there on one green. Everybody comes through if you want to walk, you know, they start on 18 and walk backwards. You see everything you're in and out. Saw everything you need to see in four hours and you get to go home. So every player you saw every hole can't do that on the PJ tour unless you want to follow one particular group around. Um, you know, so it is, which one is right though, I'm not saying one's better than the other. I'm just saying that that is what their model is, is they're trying to turn it into more of a sporting event rather than, you know, a golf tournament where, you know, if you want to go out there and see Rory McElroy and he's teeing off at two o'clock in the afternoon, you get to the golf close at four. You're sitting around a long time watching hit a shot. Yeah. Yeah. You know what? The market doesn't lie. Let the market decide what lives, well, what, you know, what lives and what doesn't. As long as the Saudis can bankroll it for as long as it will take for them to get close to a break even, correct? No, I don't think they're even worried about that to be honest with you. This is, you know, they're, they're thinking of this as nothing to do with ever making money, nothing. You know, they're trying to legitimately change the perception of their culture through golf and pay it remains to be seen to this day. It still will wait and see, right? But they're evolving too. You got to remember that they are starting to evolve as well. And will they evolve into, you know, a 72 player, you know, 12 teams, whatever it might be and, you know, cuts and, you know, they've got a feeder system now coming out of the Asian tour. There's relegation at the end of the year. So, you know, what, you know, live looks like three or four years from now is not going to be what it looks like now. And maybe it doesn't go to shotgun start. Who knows? Sure. Sure. They can do whatever they want. What happened in the Masters, what happened yesterday with the PGA, it has absolutely, it's evolving. You're absolutely right, Lego. Yeah. Yeah. Guys, we got to take a break. Let's do that. Ian Ligot, Richard Zocal, are with us and we'll be back after these messages. 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McCowan and Shannon with you. Ian Ligot, Richard Zocal are with us. Corey Connors was a part of this story. He was maybe the story for three days of the PGA Championship, showed 75 on Sunday and really fell out of contention and disappeared from television for the final round. But I've watched a fair bit. I guess we've all watched a fair bit of Corey Connors play the last while because he's been in contention more than a few times. Right. This guy hits it so straight. His driver is as probably I think as good as anybody's in terms of accuracy and his iron play is it can be exceptional. His punting comes and goes. This was a golf course. O'Kill where driving the ball accurately was maybe more important than almost any golf course I've ever seen. And I suspect that's why he was at or near the top. He has contended in a few majors. He's won twice on the PGA Tour. Is he approaching his best time right now? Is this one of the top players on the PGA Tour right now? Let me jump in there. Go ahead, Ligot. Go ahead. Go ahead. Okay. So he's continuing and you're absolutely right, Bob. His ability to drive, pretty as driving ability is so strong. It's so straight, which sets him up beautifully for US Open type and the PGA this past week was more US Open like than ever before. His ascent that he's making is really, really impressive. And he's starting to get more and more comfortable when he's in the breach. So we watched him handle Thursday, sorry, Saturday's third round. He did an excellent job other than that bad shot in the bunker where he buried it. He held that situation and that is tough to do. But what he has to continue to, he's on pace to learn and get that level of comfort when he's in the breach of a major. He has to get to a point and he's moving rapidly in that direction to being able to perform when you've got the lead on both Saturday and Sunday to get to the ability to have the lead when you run out of holes and literally the last few holes in a major championship. So he's moving in this direction. He's learning like Brooks did from last major, the Masters to this major, the PGA. Corey Connors is on a fantastic track to move it down the line so he can win major championships. He's right on track. What do you think? Yeah, well, exactly. I think exactly what Soak said. I think that he's learning by his mistakes and more so than that. I think it's just understanding how you personally feel inside mentally the nerves and everything and how you deal with that. And the more you sort of put yourself in that position, the more comfortable if you want to call it that you get. And let's be clear about it. I don't care if your Tiger Woods, Brooks, Kepto, Corey Connors or Ian, like Richard Zoko, we know what it feels like when you've got a chance to wait. It is not comfortable, you know, because this is not really your expectations go up. And, you know, there's a lot of things that can run through your mind. And I think that it's just how you deal with that. And the more you put yourself in that position, the more comfortable you get. And more so that was someone like Corey Connors who I've known for quite some time. It's just the pure belief in himself. And I think that this kind of, you know, Zoko and I have talked about this a lot about Canadian mentality. And I think it's just that he has to believe that he genuinely is one of the best players in the world. And he deserves to win major championships. He deserves it because he's a great player. He deserves it because he works hard. And I think that between, you know, his belief in himself and, you know, putting himself in those positions more and more often, I think it's inevitable that he's eventually going to get one. And, you know, it's all about putting for him. It's really genuinely all about putting for him. So Ian, Ian, what would, what would have Saturday night, Sunday morning, bean for Corey as he knows that he's in the second last group? What would the mental state he be? Would he be in over that 20 hour period? Yeah. Well, you know, at the US Open Olympia fields, I was in fifth place going into the last round. You know, the hardest part of the thing was other than, you know, being awake most of the night thinking I'm going to win the US Open was how late I teed off. And it got me out of my rhythm on the PGA tour, or we need to off in the last group. You're teeing off at 12, 31 o'clock. I was teeing off at 240 or something, my schedule. And plus never mind, I'm awake at 5.30 in the morning. So, you know, just being in those positions and understanding how to manage yourself, I think is a big, big deal in finding a good routine that gets you to that period where you go through your warm up properly and your mind isn't, you know, taking over your preparation. So I think a lot of that has an enormous amount to deal with it. And the more often he gets in that position and at the British Open, it's even worse, right? I mean, you're teeing off even later. So I think that, you know, all these things are part and parcel of being a tour player and understanding how you deal with them. Sleep is overrated. Richard on Saturday night. Well, the more comfortable you're in that situation, the better sleep you're going to have. That's the way it comes down to it. We can look at Tom Watts and we can look at Nick Faldo. Just look at Mike Weir when he was in that final group at Medina playing with Tiger. He shot 79. That's being in the breach. He learned from that situation. So when he got to 2003 on the back nine at the Masters, how he performed, even up until that last five foot put on the 18th hold that he had to make to get in the playoff, he felt comfortable enough and to be able to perform. Corey's on that track and he's going to learn. I think with what has happened in his play on Saturday and Sunday, he's going to look at himself today and go, you know what? I have gotten this close. I can do this and talking exactly what Legos talked about. His belief system is only going to get stronger and he knows in himself now that he can get this job done. Well, let's talk about that bunker shot, the fairway bunker shot that went under the lip. I mean, that wasn't just a bad shot. That was a horrible shot. Was it not? I mean, you know, if it doesn't quickly that was quickly repeated by Victor. Yeah, four hours later. So maybe, yeah, so maybe we're underestimating that we could be underestimating how difficult that shot actually was. I mean, yeah, maybe the players in the world hit the identical same shot. Yeah, maybe. That's very unusual. Like, like, I think they said that Corey had a nine iron out of there. If that's the case, he didn't get that. Like, wow, that's a bad shot. It was a bad shot. And then horrible shot. Bob, yeah, okay, that happens. And, you know, when Bob and I. We don't expect tour players to essentially roll the ball, you know, out of anywhere. And that's really what happens. I'm going to say that was a Shannon shot. That wasn't that wasn't in the Corey Connors. That was John Shannon. Well, exactly. It was, you know, 15 handicapper hits that kind of shot. I haven't played there. I haven't played there since the redesign, but I think we're underestimating probably the face of how steep it actually was. So when you look at just no possibility that two guys and by the way, two high ball hitters in Victor, Hobbling and Corey Connors. These are not low ball guys that both hit the identical same shot. I think that we've got to put some degree of difficulty on the shot rather than mostly just the. I grant you all that. You know, I know it wasn't an easy shot, but guess what? He hit it one inch off the ground. You know, it happens. It's a hard shot. Yeah. Two player Shane shots as well from time to time. So you don't see that often. No, you don't see it often, but it does happen. The other great story on the weekend and I was Michael Block. Yeah. I think the, you know, the pro out of California. Tell me you have to. Richard, tell me you didn't have tears in your eyes. Oh, absolutely. What is it's a Cinderella story? Like I did a little bit of research on me. He's played. He's made five cuts. He's played in 25 PGA tour events. So 35 years ago there, Lonnie Nielsen was the finish. I think he finished sixth. But Lonnie Nielsen played on the tour for years before he went down, lost his ability, became a club pro and then qualified. Michael Block was never a tour player. He was a club pro and to do what he did was phenomenal. To make a hole in one, he didn't even realize he made a hole in one until after Rory hugged him. I mean, this is unbelievable. What a remarkable story. I tweeted out Lego. You're like this. I tweeted last night, do you think Liv makes him an offer? If I was Liv, I'd make him an offer. It's such a good story. I think everybody on the PGA Tourist is deciding whether to make him an offer. I'm interested. I know the CEO of Golf Canada was in Rochester this weekend. I wonder whether he invited them in a game of an invitation. How many exemptions will he got now? I'm going to talk about that one. I just want to get by the way, I love the story. I think the story was amazing. But let's put this into perspective because it's getting a little bit crazy. Someone did and Brian Crawford, who's the tournament director for the RBC Canadian Open, actually sort of on Twitter offered him a spot. There you go. Completely disagree. Completely disagree with this. When we've got our own national open, and by the way, the story here is about a club pro. It's not about some mini tour guy that did this. The story made sense to everybody, and it really meant a lot to their membership. If you saw, they didn't show other golf clubs in the country. They showed his golf club in Mission VAO. Everybody crowded in the clubhouse, cheering for them and everything. It has a huge impact on his club, right? And the community. I think it'd be a big mistake for Golf Canada. Nobody's going, by the way, if he's going to play this week at Colonial, he goes out and misses the cut. He is no longer a story in the game of golf. We've seen this many, many times. Many times, yeah. Right? And we're going to offer a guy a spot in our national open that we could genuinely give this to another club pro. Give it to a club pro. Doesn't have to be a mini tour player. Give it to another club pro because that would mean so much to their membership and to their junior members at the club that their pro is playing in the Canadian Open. I think if we're talking about what this means to Canadian golf, Michael Block showing up there is a story that everybody, he goes out there and shoots 79 in the first round at Oakdale. Nobody is going to care. Unless he keeps performing like this. Now we got a different story. I'll give you that. And that's a tall order. Let me ask you a question. I'm not normally a conspiracy theorist, but did Michael Block get more attention because Brooks kept his on live? 100%. 100%. 100%. I think a lot of the golf journalists tried to make this story and someone even made a comment as a journalist. They call it the PGA tours using Michael Block to hijack Brooks kept his way. Yeah. Which is true. I don't know. No, I think if you go on Twitter right now, you'll see so much more about Michael Block than you will about Brooks kept. And you know, is it fair? Absolutely. It's fair. I think it's an amazing story. I think it's a great story. I think that the passion and the love that he has for the game of golf is something that, you know, for us is now, you know, sort of in that side of the business, I think is amazing. I think it doesn't be a credible amount for the game of golf. Brooks kept his win. There's no denying what he did. It was remarkable. It's not even on the same level of what Michael Block did. It's just Michael Block's a Cinderella story. I mean, Brooks kept his win was historic. It was remarkable. It was fantastic. But you know, you just don't get cinder. There's never been a Cinderella story like that. Well, there has to be a question. Which one? Who Justin Rose in the British Open, 17 years old, finished second, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, and then all of a sudden everybody jumped all over Justin Rose and turned pro. Oh, he is the next coming. He signed multi-million dollar tie. Try on is another one. I mean, I know we haven't had any great performance. Yeah, he didn't have a great performance. Everybody he's he if you want to call it hijack the PGA tour story. But Justin Rose, the perfect example. Well, I mean, I wouldn't call it a hijack. I mean, it just was a good story. No, I'm just using that as an analogy of a golf writer. But I mean, I love the story. I think it was a great story line that gets away from professional golf. 46 years old leg. OK, I can't imagine. I know it's awesome. I just made done. Maybe I'll tell you what, Stephen better is going to be even better when he turns 50 and starts winning, you know, Champions Tour events would be a fantastic story. He's got to perform to get out there. That let's see if he keeps performing. Look at this. I think he's at a fork in a row. Do you not work? Like does he become a tour player now? I mean, I think there's... Yeah, I don't know. I think it... Well, the only way he'd become a tour player is if Liv Off made him an offer. And he accepted. Do you think that's a real possibility? That's no chance that's going to happen. Absolutely. By the way, because all those teams are owned by the players. There isn't a single captain on team Sergio Garcia, Dustin Johnson is not saying she's going to give up one of my guys. No, but not all Liv players are on teams, right? Yeah, they are. They're all on teams? Everyone? Every single one of those guys is on a team now. Yeah, and they get relegated at the end of the year. If they don't perform, I think it's the low 12 players get literally get kicked off the tour and they come off of the Asian tour. The toddler 12 or 10 guys are on the Asian tour. They're placed on to Liv teams next year. So that's just not a possibility. But I would love for him. And by the way, as a club pro, the way he plays and so knows this, the way that he plays the game, he might play pretty good around colonial. He very well made. You're right. It's not a long golf course. And there's any golf course he could play well. He could play that one well. Yeah. I don't know how you would categorize whether he could sell tickets or not to the event. But I'll tell you what, he tees it up next week. There'll be a bunch of people who will make a point of following him. Do you not agree? Yes. Yeah. He'd be just about as popular as any player out there. Yeah, he brings a new level of interest, a new... Exactly. And it's a story, one that brings value. But again, to Legos more, if he starts missing cuts in these events, it's over. It'll be over in a big hurry. Like, is it a guy? He's gonna be another guy. That's gonna cut. That's it. Shoot 75 and he'll be, he'll be, as to these news, no one will care anymore. But as long as he keeps performing this way, the Canadian Open is what? A month away? A little over a month? A little less than that? Less than that? Yeah. I don't know. I didn't invite him. I didn't invite him for attendance if for no other reason. I think people will buy tickets. Someone says, can I play? Well, unfortunately, the RBC Canadian Open might be needing it this year, just primarily because of the date, because it's not an elevated event. The US Open the Week before is in LA. I mean, they're back to the big hurdles they used to have to cross years ago. They're back in a difficult position. Yeah. Yeah. So hopefully they can become an elevated event for next year when the tour comes out with their new schedule. They deserve it. As you know, what's happened to last? Do you think the Canadian Open moves? Yeah. Well, they're gonna have to move or become an elevated event. So that's gonna, it's gonna have to be one or the other. But at the elevated events, that's where they're gonna, and now, by the way, heritage is an elevated event. Yeah, RBC is not renewed. Either one, either contract yet. So they're kind of holding the cards right now, and I hope it works out because, you know, and we're biased. I would hope, of course, I would hope and do hope that RBC has negotiated already because RBC sponsors the Heritage Classic, which is a designated event, that their agreement with the PGA tour would include the RBC Canadian Open becoming a designated event next year. I mean, RBC is a huge, I think, if not the first or the second best, are most wealthy companies, sponsors of the PGA tour. They hold a lot of clout. They should. The Canadian Open has the history. I would be, you know, shot. I hope that they continue to have leveraged this position and become a designated event in 2004. But even more than that, Zoke, I think that there is not a company that I can think of in golf, in professional golf, the sponsors and event. Now a lot of these events do a lot of great things for local charities. Nobody does more for golf in a country than RBC. You're absolutely true. And if you're talking about the PGA tour, legitimately growing the game, I mean, nobody does more for the game of golf than RBC. I mean, I can't think of, I could be wrong. I mean, you know, I don't think there's any other company that sponsor PGA tour events that legitimately do for the game of golf what RBC does. And I've got some information where RBC very much wanted the LA Open, but Jenison Reap, they wanted that Southern California market to grow globally. You know, they're growing. Tremendously tremendous global company, but they very much wanted that. And really, Genesis re-opted, they had first crack at it and RBC didn't get the LA Open. Guys, I'd love to keep our conversation going, but unfortunately we're out of time. So we got to get out of here. We thank you both for being with us once again. And we'll look forward to talk to you again, probably around the Canadian Open. Thank you Richard. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you Jack. We'll be back after this. When was the last time everyone agreed on what's for dinner? You want Chinese food, they want pizza, and someone is always craving froyo. Well, there's something for everyone on DoorDash. Ordering is easy. Open up the DoorDash app, choose what you want from where you want, and your items will be left safely outside your door with our default contactless delivery setting. For a limited time, our listeners can get 25% off and zero delivery fees on their first order of $15 or more when you download the DoorDash app and enter code Bobcast23. That's 25% off, up to $10 in value, and zero delivery fees on your first order when you download the DoorDash app in the App Store and enter code Bobcast23. Don't forget, that's code Bobcast23 for $20. 25% off of your first order with DoorDash. Subject to change, terms apply. We are back, and our thanks once again to Ian Leggett, Richard Zocal for joining us. That was a fascinating conversation on a lot of different topics. Yeah, it was. Well, there were some great stories on the weekend. Let's face it, there really were. Well, the politics of golf now are, you know, they're hovering over everything, aren't they? Bob, that's the fascination for us, you know, but we're golf fans then. Yeah. If you're not a golf fan, I guess you don't care. No, no, we recorded our show Friday well before Brendan Shanahan's press conference when he announced that Kyle Dubas would no longer be the general manager of the Toronto Maple Leaves and quickly your thoughts. Well, I think you know what my thoughts are. I know your thoughts, but we're probably going to talk about it tomorrow. I've been saying you should get rid of this guy. Yeah, enough. Well, I mean, this is certainly the second year in a row. You were not prepared to give him the benefit of the doubt. So do you think your living is a candidate for the job? Uh, he's got to be on the list, but I'm not sure that I'm not sure it's a fit for Brad here. I really am not. Well, I like him. So I like him. Yeah, if he's interested in, I hope he gets it, but I have no clue. Yeah, I don't know. Like this one in the way it was managed on Friday by Brendan, it leads you to think that, you know, they've got a little bit of an uphill battle to go quickly. And that's the one positive thing for Brad in this situation is that he's available now. And that to me is the fascination. Now I don't know how quickly they're going to be able to find a general manager. Do you think they're going to look for somebody who's got experience? Yes, they've already said that there. Brendan said that he needs somebody that understands the ins and outs of being a manager in this league that has, has some, uh, some qualities and is sat in that room with the other managers. So that I think that's a factor. There's, there's going to be no new general manager this time around in Toronto. The, uh, if you look at the candidates that are being talked about, a bunch of them are assisted general managers. Do you think that's enough? No, I don't. Um, you know, there, there's probably, listen, there are two candidates internally that, uh, in Brandon Pridham and Lawrence Gilman that should probably deserve some consideration long before they go to a, an assistant general manager outside of the organization. Those two guys probably have better pedigree than a lot of the guys that are, that are trying to have, they haven't been general managers in the NHL, which should technically disqualify them, right? It should, but understanding how MLSE works and understand how the Maple Leafs go and understand the mistakes that have been made in, uh, with the Maple Leafs, I think is the institutional knowledge is almost as important as anything else. Do you think Shanahan now stays? Oh, yeah. I think this, I think this was an affirmation that Brendan Shanahan is the king. And who will make the face of the franchise? And who will make the decision on the head coach? Will it be the GM? It will be the GM, but you know that Brendan will have his fingers in the pie. So they'll wait for the general manager and then they'll make a decision on who, whether it's Sheldon Keith will continue or they'll have somebody new to coach the team. One of the things you don't see a lot is a coach, an GM, both fired in the same year and a, a search for the two positions going on simultaneously. Right. Seems like that's heavy lifting, don't you? Well, except that if you, if you're a general manager that has pedigree and you know the way this league ticks and you have strong beliefs on how your team is going to play, you want to bring your own coach in. The question becomes is for the long, for many people, Bob, that, that, that living with the existing coach becomes a little bit of a bulletproof vest for you for a year or two. But you know, you have to sit down with Sheldon and say, what's your philosophy? How can you change? What will you do? And I think that that's an important part of the process for a new manager. If they are looking for a coach quickly, Quenville, apparently will talk with Gary Betman and try and get, get reinstated. Yeah. You think he becomes immediately the top candidate for coach Elise? I think he comes the top candidate for 25 teams. Well, that I'll give you all the others. Yeah. You think the least as well? Yes. Yes. And do you think that'll happen? That he'll get hired or that he'll get cleared? That he'll be allowed? Yes. Yeah. I believe by the middle of July, we'll know that Joel Quenville is a he and Stan Bowman will be allowed to get jobs again. All right. We've got to get out of here. I think we're out of time for John Shannon. This is Bob McCown. We'll see you tomorrow. Thank you, everybody. Bye bye. Bye bye. Okay.