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It's the crossover, Sports Illustrateds, NBA show, ring of bell, The latest news, rumors,
and everything in between.
Here's your host, Chris Manix, Roja Dada, Khadim, and Chris Herring.
And we are back crossover NBA podcast.
I'm Chris Manix.
We are recording this on a Friday afternoon where we have at least one NBA conference finalist
already set, joined from South Florida by Rowan Narkerney.
And from New York, Chris Herring, who is eagerly awaiting to see the outcome of his
Nick's series against the Miami Heat.
I was going to get to Heat vs. Nick's a little bit later on, but I want to start with what
we saw in Philadelphia last night, which was both an embarrassing collapse by the 76ers
and a virtuoso four and a half minute performance by Jason Tatum in the final half of that fourth
quarter.
Tatum scored 16 points.
The Celtics pull off a double digit win, and we have a game seven on Sunday in Boston.
So Herring, I'll start with you.
Are you more impressed by what Tatum did down the stretch or disappointed by what you saw
from Philadelphia?
That's a really great question.
I think on some level, I'm not shocked that Tatum did that.
It was still really wild to watch it play out, but there have been so many moments.
And at this point, and I know Rowan just wrote this story about the fact that at this point
you have no choice but to take Denver seriously, that was a moment where Philly could have stepped
on Boston's throat and basically said, we're here looking at the other side of it.
We've got an eight seed and a five seed on the other side of the bracket.
This is ours to take and and be big in MVP.
You got a couple of 40 point games from Hardin in this series.
Maxie has been fantastic.
This was an opportunity.
This was on their home floor.
They're not going to have anybody to blame but themselves if they if they don't get this
done and seven they took game one without him.
Bead they had a golden opportunity there.
I mean you hold Jason Tatum to one of 14 or whatever it was to start a game.
I don't care if he makes four threes at the end of it or whatever it was.
Tatum we know he's capable and we know if he makes one that he's going to feel like
he can make them all.
But that doesn't excuse Philly's defense offense just falling off a cliff at the end
of the game.
I thought that they could have won that game despite Tatum regaining a rhythm at the end
of it.
Whereas the flip side of it was Boston was not going to win without Tatum doing anything
and I you know that became clear but that doesn't mean Philly couldn't have won the
game.
It's disappointing from that standpoint and it's one of those tough things where you don't
get to wallow over that.
I wrote in my book about the 90s nicks that John Starks had insomnia essentially developed
insomnia after having his shop locked at the end of a game six that you know could have
won the title for them and it stayed with them for days and it kind of bled into the
next game.
You can't afford that if you're Philly because you've shown now that you're toe to toe with
this team.
You're capable of beating this team.
You should have beaten this team.
But I do say that you know that I would say that the disappointment should be heavier from
that standpoint than the impressed feeling that I had from Tatum because we knew he was
capable of that.
Yeah, Rowan, I don't want to take anything away from Jason Tatum.
I want to get to him in a minute and what Boston did in that game but this was such a
moment for Philadelphia.
They haven't been to a conference finals since 2001.
Not an NBA finals, not a championship.
They haven't been to a conference finals since 2001 and they survived an early storm from
Boston.
They turned a seven point halftime deficit into a two point lead going into the fourth
quarter.
Jason Tatum was just a mess.
You go even like eight minutes or at the eight minute mark of that fourth quarter.
I think I tweeted this out like Tatum was just standing around like just didn't look
like he was engaged in this game at all.
And then the final like five minutes, did they even score a bucket in that final five
minutes?
I mean, Joellen Bead made a note of this after the game.
He didn't even touch the ball.
Like he's got to have the ball in his hands in those situations.
I thought this was an epic fail by Philadelphia not to win this game six.
Okay, I've been from the moment that game ended, I've been waiting to get on this podcast
because I have so much to say all day yesterday, preparing all my tweets, making fun of the
city of Boston for their impending collapse in this game, getting ready to come on this
podcast.
Talk mad shit to Manix.
I didn't wait excited all day.
Philly's going into the fourth quarter with a lead.
Guys, this was a pathetic performance by the Sixers.
Epic failure is just scratching the surface.
For the last two years, Joel and Bead complaining about why am I not the MVP?
I'm the MVP.
He gets a beautiful feature written about him by Chris Manix and Sports Illustrated.
I want to be the MVP.
He gets the award in the last six minutes of the game, 0 for 2, no points, no rebounds,
no assists.
Are you kidding me?
The fact that they couldn't get him the ball, could you imagine Janus going six minutes
in a fourth quarter of a closeout game without getting the ball?
You see what Nicola Yokech has been doing in the second round?
He touches the ball in every single possession for the Nuggets.
I thought it was inexcusable.
I thought it was embarrassing.
The fact that James Harden is firing these rocket passes to the corner with 15 seconds
on the shot clock and says, D. Anthony Mountain, you shoot, PJ Tucker, you shoot.
They played that fourth quarter like they had a 10-point lead and they kept going for
these home run shots.
I thought it was pathetic.
I thought their offensive process was terrible.
They didn't get anything going at the rim for seemingly the last six minutes of the game.
I thought Tyrese Maxi was the only player who seemingly had guts for Philly last night.
So Bice Harris, two points in 42 minutes.
He's lucky Jason Tatum was as bad as he was with three and a half quarters because we'd
be killing Tobias Harris way more today for that performance.
One of seven, two points in 42 minutes.
You could throw Manix out there, his hair gel dripping into his eyes.
I bet he could come up with one bucket in 42 minutes.
I was just blown away by how bad Philly was in the fourth quarter of this game.
You go into the fourth quarter with a lead at home.
What Chris said, with the chance to step on Boston's throat, knock out what was the title
favorite headed into this round at the very least.
To me, as much as we praised James Harden and Joel Embiid for some of the performances
they put up earlier in this series, this was the biggest stage for them.
I thought they were both awful down the stretch.
And you look at Harden and Tatum's final stat lines.
I mean, it's not like Harden played that much better.
He was a little bit more efficient.
You know, his scoring just wasn't his back loaded.
I'm, I was in shock watching the fourth quarter, watching Philly just completely just triple
over themselves offensively.
I thought it was pathetic, frankly.
I really did.
I don't know how I got dragged in that situation, but whatever.
I do agree with you.
It was a complete meltdown by Philly.
They didn't react well at all to Boston's adjustment to go too big.
That was a big factor in this game.
Robert Williams was plus 18 overall.
And you could see early on the impact that he had just giving James Harden and Tyreece
Maxie and, you know, something to think about when they went to the rim, giving, you know,
Joel Embiid something to think about as he was coming off and defending screens because,
you know, when you're defending a Rob Williams screen, you got to be wary of that lob.
Like that's just, that's what he does offensively.
And I thought that was a good adjustment by Joe Missoula and not one that the Sixers adjusted
to all that well.
And look, we've got to give credit to the Celtics, you know, the role players on that
team.
Marcus smart was great.
You know, he had some moments where he had Marcus marks the moments there where he had
some bad turnovers, trying to thread the needle a couple of too many times.
But overall, he was terrific offensively, defensively, the whole package.
Jalen Brown, before he got into foul trouble, he made some plays for the Malcolm Brogdon,
had 16 points coming off the bench.
Joe Missoula tightened that rotation, only played seven guys in game six.
And I thought that was impactful.
And, yeah, Grant Williams, I don't think it was his fault necessarily, but keeping Rob
Williams in that starting lineup and keeping the rotation tight, that worked for them,
not playing Sam Houser, that worked for them.
So I think everybody within the Celtics should get credit for keeping them in it until Jason
Tate and caught fire and took over at the end.
So now we had to do a game seven, Herring.
And I don't know what to predict here.
I don't know what to expect in this game seven.
The Celtics are going home, but they have lost their last two games in the garden.
They lost game five in in biblically bad fashion in the garden to the Sixers.
You go back to the Atlanta series, lost game five to the Hawks in the garden.
So this is not a shoe win if they go home, you know, going home.
And this, all the pressure that was on Boston in that game seven, it's still there, but
there's even more pressure on Philadelphia.
Joellen B is going to go into that game seven.
Well, Nicole Yokich is kicking back on his couch in Denver, reminding everyone, this
is his second, the conference finals that he's gone to.
All those people that said Nicole Yokich would not be, you know, the same guy in the playoffs
wouldn't be as reliable as Joellen Bead.
Well, Yokich sitting there waiting for that other side of the bracket to finish and Jo
Ellen Bead is fighting for his playoff life.
So there's a lot of pressure there.
James Harden, if they get beat in the second round and they lose too straight to finish,
I already think it's lunacy to give James hard a two hundred plus million dollar contract.
I think that's nuts, but I think it would effectively ensure that Philadelphia wouldn't
go in that direction because why would you?
You have not advanced further than you advanced before James Harden got there.
So there's pressure on him.
There's pressure on Doc Rivers who could be coaching for his job, you know, in this,
in this game.
So I think the pressure has now shifted squarely to Philadelphia.
Harry, what do you think?
It has.
I mean, I don't think that's to say that as you kind of laid out that Boston doesn't have
any.
I take them the early stages of these games.
Like I don't know what it is that because I mean, he's still getting good enough looks.
Some of the shots are just rimming out, but other times he just looks like, I don't know
why I keep referencing Space Jam so much, but he looks like the monster saptas talent
like in the first half of these games.
And I mean, that's not to take away from the playmaking.
I know he had was it six assistant half or whatever it was or early in the third quarter.
He's still making plays.
He's still there defensively.
Boston was fantastic defensively and deserves a lot of credit for that early in the game.
I thought that they were just taking away everything at the rim, which is obviously part
of having the two bigs out there.
But you know, I don't think this necessarily solves all their problems just because they
won this game.
I know that's not what you're hinting at, Chris.
But you know, until something else shifts, they, I don't think they're demonstrably better.
Maybe they get to breathe a little bit more comfortably, but they've struggled enough
here in these last few games to where I don't think anything is a given for them just because
they managed to do this.
I will say that from Tatum's standpoint, if they do come out and win this series, get
to the finals, maybe win the whole thing, the way that this game six is going to be looked
at and Tatum's performance coming through there is going to be talked about as like
a Kobe sort of moment of a Michael Jordan sort of.
I mean, we also saw the stats that suggested that there've only been a handful of people
ever in this situation, or at least in the last 20, 30 years, whatever it's been, who
performed that poorly as a volume shooter and then come through and just kind of torn
the roof off the place.
So I could very much see it being that sort of thing.
There's pressure both ways.
I do think there's more riding on it for Philly, even just from the standpoint of Joe
Missoula, he's not going anywhere after this season.
It Boston for some reason doesn't come through and win this.
We can't say that about Doc for sure.
And the hardened thing, I mean, it's tough.
I'm sure he's probably like, damn, didn't I just have 45 and 42?
But even if they do win this series and falter in the next series or anything, giving hard
and the max of what he could earn just seems like a no go here for me, just because it's
too on and off.
It's not consistent.
He's not the same guy consistently anymore, which you will also expect, given where he's
at age wise, the load that he's carried.
But yeah, there's just more riding on it for Philly certainly, but Boston's not without
pressure here by any means.
Yeah, it's not that the Celtics don't have pressure.
It's just if they lose, they're going to get cooked for it.
I mean, Tatum will get cooked for it.
Brown will get cooked for it.
Bazzoula will get cooked for it.
But I don't think there'd be any kind of tangible ripple effect.
I mean, Jalen Brown just got all NBA.
That to me pretty well signals that he's going to sign a max level extension with Boston
this summer.
Jason Tatum's not going anywhere.
I'm still curious about that.
The Celtics will pay them.
It's more a question of I don't think and me and Ron have had this conversation.
I think it was an episode where you weren't with us.
Like we don't think he's leaving, but at the same time he strikes me as enough of a wild
card and enough of a guy that on principle might just say like, man, I'm going to make
a lot of money wherever I go.
I think you have to be unhappy.
But there was more unhappiness under the surface than what I realized before those comments
came out not once, but basically twice in like a week long span.
Oh, I don't think this I don't think signing the extension, you know, makes Brown a Celtic
for life.
I just think he's going to take the money.
I mean, the fair.
Okay.
So the number of people in his orbit that were lobbying for Jalen Brown to be all NBA
this year, you know, I heard some of it too.
Like, you know, I mean, it's great to be all NBA.
It's a nice accolade a feather in the cap, but it's the tangible effect of it.
The fact that you can now get a super max contract that's worth $200 and what $95 million
on the long end of that deal.
I think the self is law for it.
I think Tatum will sign it.
And then we'll see, you know, Tatum as we see.
From lots of players in recent years, he could just ask out and the self is way before us
to trade him down the line.
The Sixers, they could be reinvented after this year.
Joel Embiid's not going anywhere, but he could have a new coach.
He could have a new wingman.
The only sure fire guys that'll be around next year are Joel Embiid and Tyree Smacksey,
I think.
So this is everything for Philadelphia.
Like this is, this is their season.
This is their future.
There's a lot on the line for the 76ers in this game seven on Sunday.
All right.
I want to talk about what we saw in that Phoenix.
Man, actually, real quick.
Do you mind if I, I got a question for you, a serious one before we move on to that next
series.
So I tweeted last night before the fourth quarter because you could already see the
Tatum discourse on Twitter spiraling a bit, which is never really a good place to get
your discourse in general.
But, you know, I said something to the effect of this guy is only 25.
He had 46 on the road in Milwaukee last year.
He took the team to the finals as a 24 year old as their best player.
You know, he's had big game sevens on the road.
I, I think his resume is pretty good.
Yes, he struggled in the finals.
A lot of players struggle in their first finals.
A lot of greats have struggled in the finals before.
You know, and here I am defending Jason Tatum and I got a lot of Celtics fans tweeting at
me, how much longer are we going to give him a pass?
He keeps throwing up small.
I was kind of shocked that there was any of this sentiment out there.
I'm curious if you've, if you've picked that up or do you know where that kind of like,
there's a seems to be a weird, like a little bit of a Tatum backlash brewing and I wonder
if you sense a similar thing.
Yeah, but it's Boston.
There's a backlash.
If you don't succeed at the highest level every single year, like, you know, all that,
all that backlash quickly, you know, did a 180 after Tatum went off in, in the last
four and a half minutes of the fourth quarter.
It looked, I think there is some anxiety about this season because look, the runway is clear.
The bucks are no longer in it.
The Western Conference, even though Denver is really good, you know, Denver's certainly
not unbeatable.
Like this looks like and feels like the year this Celtics team can win a championship.
You can't always say that about previous years.
And then went to the conference finals, you know, those years before at Rantill LeBron
James, you know, you're not going to beat LeBron, even if you take him to seven games
in one of those series last year, even though they had a two one series lead, you're still
going up against Golden State.
And that team was, was just better than the Celtics were at this time.
I don't think there's a team out there, including Denver, that's better than Boston right now.
I think they're the best team that's left behind.
And if they go out because Jason Tatum, the de facto superstar, the top five MVP, the
all NBA first team guy, because he plays terrible.
Yeah, he would have become, you know, public enemy number one for a while in Boston.
That's for sure.
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All right, let's talk about the suns and the nuggets.
And let's start with the good, Rowan.
Let's start with Denver.
The nuggets better than we thought they were coming into the playoffs.
I just mentioned how, you know, Yokich was, you know, part of the reason he didn't win
MVP is probably because there were a lot of people out there that thought that he was
going to flame out in the playoffs.
That if it wasn't the first round against Minnesota, he was definitely going out in
the second round against the Clippers or the Suns.
Turns out not so much.
Yokich puts up monster numbers in this series, kicks the crap out of everybody in Phoenix.
DeAndre Eitan basically waved the white flag at the end of that series.
That's how miserable he was.
Wow, wow.
Come on.
Come on.
Let's be real.
I'm not going there.
I think DeAndre Eitan was, I bet, do you think DeAndre Eitan deep down was happy last night?
Part of me thinks he was a little happy.
I don't know, man.
Look, far be it for me to criticize a guy with an injury.
Guys, I'm about to criticize a guy with an injury.
You already have.
It's, but it kind of felt like it, it kind of felt like it threw in the towel.
I'm just saying like a rip injury, a rip injury feels like playing like something you can
play through, right?
If you really have to, you can play through some kind of pain.
We got guys this way.
We can have some sort of rip thing too.
So it's like it is interesting.
I didn't realize it's also tough not being at the game.
You think Wigens isn't going to play?
You think Wigens isn't going to play?
I think he's going to play.
That's what I'm saying is it starts to look a whole lot.
Yeah.
I mean, it's a tough scene.
And I mean, the only reason I hesitate to do that, I haven't spoken to the guy really
before that I know of.
I've been in their locker room before.
I don't think I've ever talked with him specifically.
So I just hesitate to do it without knowing him.
But look, we've seen that there've been, you know, there's been turbulence in that locker
room before.
We know, I mean, the last time we talked about this sort of turbulence with Phoenix was when
they got rocked in a deciding game last season, you know, at home, no less.
And he was on the bench for that one too.
Where, you know, Monty had plenty to say by basically saying nothing about DeAndre Aiden.
So I get that part.
It's, I can't remember someone being having kind of their perception colored more by one
moment, particularly like a top pick, then I can with that in recent memory.
I'm sure if I really thought about it, maybe I could, but I really, it's really interesting
like how little he seems to say out loud, but how much has been colored by that moment.
So I, I'm not going to say it's fair.
It's not.
I won't quite go that far.
But I remember thinking, wow, for all the stuff that everybody else is playing through,
a D in his situation, where let's be honest, if we're going to talk about our takes here,
the guy looked like he was skin cussed.
And it seemed very clear that like maybe the Lakers didn't want to test him for a concussion
because they didn't want to get back bad news and then have to put him in protocol.
The fact that they said that.
The wheel shared wheel shared off the floor.
Hi, wheel shared, woozy, we saw him the fact that there were, I think Dave McMendemann
from ESPN took video of him leaving the arena and the person walking with AD asked the person
to turn off the lights that were in front of him because of that.
Like it, it kind of telltale things that look like the guy is concussed.
And then the, the, there was never an official statement from the Lakers.
The one that I remember seeing, I think from Chris Hain saying that he appeared to have
avoided a concussion.
I'm like, did you test him for one?
And I'm not convinced that they, I'm not convinced at all that they did, but even him,
he had the idea that he's playing through this one.
Yeah.
Like where is the, like, look, I don't want to see Anthony Davis in out game six.
I mean, this neither do I, but I agree, but I agree with you.
Yeah.
You, you have to go through the process.
Otherwise your process is utterly meaningless.
It doesn't matter if like campaign, you know, is concussed in game six, game 62 of the regular
season.
Yes.
That's not the, where your concussion protocols get really tested.
It's right now in this situation when, again, none of us on this pod are doctors, but you
just have to see the reaction of Anthony Davis, how he looked on the bench, how he'd be wheel
chaired out, how much time he spent in the locker room and how he was walking, as Chris
said, with his guy in front of him saying, turn off the light.
These are all pretty telltale signs of a concussion and, and look, the Lakers know if he goes
in concussion protocols, he ain't playing game six.
There's just not enough time.
Probably in that game seven either, to be honest.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So it's, it's tough from that standpoint.
I got us away from the conversation you were raising, which was about, yeah, it's because
I got a, I got a lot of nuggets takes loaded fire away, Roland, because I do, I do think
that, you know, we, and I use that kind of the royal we here, we generally media fans,
everybody probably didn't give the nuggets the credit they deserve coming into the playoffs.
Well, if I may quote a famous Miami poet, Rick Ross, no sir, not me, because I, we,
we did.
Do that here.
2022.
We did in late 2022 are, we were asked for 2023 predictions, and I predicted the nuggets
would win the finals.
They were my finals pick before the season.
And they have been so good.
I literally wrote for today for sort of illustrated.com.
Are you taking the nuggets seriously yet?
Nicole Yolkitch in the second round, you know, the beltsman passed around a little bit.
I think Jimmy Butler had it.
I think Devin Booker had it.
There's nobody in the universe playing basketball better right now than Nicole Yolkitch.
35 points, 13 rebounds in tennis, sis on 59% shooting in the second round.
In the playoffs, he's at 31, 13 and 9.7.
He's three assists away from averaging a triple double for the entire playoffs.
He has been unreal.
Jamal Murray and Nicole Yolkitch are not discussed enough as one of the best duos in the NBA.
The last time they were healthy for the playoffs, they knocked out Kewai and PG the only time
they were healthy for the postseason.
This year they knock out Kevin Durant and Devin Booker.
I know the sons were undermanned, but this is exactly the kind of team everyone thought
would expose Denver defensively.
What if I told you in the postseason, the Denver Nuggets have a better defensive rating
than the Philadelphia 76ers?
They've been really good defensively on balance for the postseason.
They've been better defensively.
Hold on.
I have the list here.
Then the Lakers, the Knicks, the 76ers, like they've been really good.
They've been legit defensively.
They're not necessarily locking people down.
When everyone comes in, oh, teams are going to run 75 pick and rollers.
I think that's what Jamal Crawford said.
They're going to put the MVP and pick and roll every night.
Guess what?
Anthony Davis is putting the pick and roll every night.
Joel Embiid is putting the pick and roll every night.
Yolkitch has, I think, stood up to the task.
He's been fantastic.
This team is really good.
To say they're a legitimate contender, I think is an understatement.
I would have them as the title favorite right now.
I agree, Boston, on paper, you think should be better, what they did in the regular season.
Up to an offensive defense.
Has the profile of a title contender, but no one is playing better than the Nuggets.
No one's playing more connected than the Nuggets.
They have a deep team.
The guys they brought in the offseason, Bruce Brown, Contavious Callwell, Pope have filled
their roles to a tee.
To me, this team's been fantastic.
I get it the last month of the season.
It was kind of like, what are they doing here?
Why is this team taking its foot off the gas?
That seems more intentional now than anything else because the way they've ramped up in
the postseason has been fantastic.
I'll just end on this note because Yokich obviously didn't win his third MVP.
I think people have been skeptical about his first two.
They're sick of the idea that he was going to win a third.
They think he's just this advanced stats guy.
You look at the MVP finalists, Yokich, Janus, and Bead.
Yokich has been far and away the best player.
It's not close.
And Bead, his points are down, his rebounds are down, his sister down, his field goal
percentages down, his turnovers are up.
It's the opposite for Yokich.
He's just been incredible.
And I think at this point, I think it would be an upset if this team didn't at least make
the finals.
Herring, anything to add to that?
No, I mean, first of all, can we just say, first of all, I was surprised that Yokich didn't
get more votes.
I went with them Bead for MVP, but I thought it would be closer than it was.
It might have been if Mark Jackson had given Yokich.
And I've never seen somebody call into the radio station sooner than he did.
By the way, by the way, I got just went public in 10 minutes later.
I got bumped.
That was my slot on NBA Radio.
I was in a car going to the TV studio.
I got a call saying Mark Jackson's going in.
I got bumped.
Amen.
He made a B line to that phone conversation.
There was a wrong thing.
Can I just ask, can I real quick, Chris?
Do you guys think you really made a mistake?
Do we really think he made a mistake?
It sounds to me like he got confused with what he was voting for, exactly.
We should say what he did.
He thought it was good.
Let me set it up, right?
So only one voter, and we knew this a couple of weeks ago when the MVP or a week or so
ago against this point, when the MVP award voting came out, but we didn't know, we knew
that one voter did not put Nicole Yokich in the top five.
We did not know until Thursday who that voter was, but the NBA reveals all the ballots.
They're transparent with this process.
It was revealed that Mark Jackson, the former head coach, ESPN NBA analyst, he was the one
that did not vote for Nicole Yokich.
Now Mark Jackson, as Harry said, quickly came out and said, no, it was a mistake.
It was a mistake.
I didn't mean to do it.
Harry, I got a hard time kind of buying that because look, number one, you have opposite
opportunities to kind of fact check yourself before you submit your ballot, right?
So for people to understand this, you, there are scroll down tiles that you, where you
pick the top five or top three, whatever it is that you're putting for MVP at the end
of the ballot before you submit it, it kind of shows you who you voted for.
And then you get an email with who you voted for.
So you get multiple opportunities to double check who was on your ballot.
And by the way, on top of that, the NBA also has kind of a failsafe here.
Mark Prusar, but the NBA, like for example, there's two jail in Williams in Oklahoma City,
two rookies.
Mark Prusar, but the NBA was on standby for a while to make sure that if the right guy
got voted for it, if they didn't, you know, he was, you were going to get a, he was going
to call you to double check what happened if you voted for the exact right guy.
So I don't know, man.
I think that, that to me, Herring is a pretty, well, I want to make it.
I do believe what his argument was of how he mistakenly did it.
I think he was saying that because he says, like, you can tell I put one center, two forwards
and two guards is what he said in his quote.
Maybe he was like an all-in-game team with the way that he voted for it, but I still like,
okay, or maybe he's like, it's an, maybe he's like, it's not important.
Who goes after number one?
You know what I mean?
Oh, no.
I had a ton, like a lot of people were just saying, and I kind of agreed with this, but
like also, I don't know him all enough.
He's probably maybe telling the truth, but for me, I'm like, oh, that seems like a difficult
way.
First of all, we had an all-in-b-a team, the first team that you could have voted for that
you did vote for.
If you had a vote, you were voting for that too.
So what, you were going to vote for that NBA team twice.
Whatever.
Like, I would have had, I would have felt more strongly about this if it was a situation
where Yolkich was unanimous and that this is the one guy that doesn't vote for him at
all.
Yolkich didn't win, and it fundamentally wasn't like the vote made the difference between
Yolkich winning or not.
But my whole only point was to say, you could have gone either way.
I think you could have gone any one of three ways to vote for this, and I'm not going to
side-eye you that hard.
I, frankly, and I think maybe I don't want to use the word guilty because I don't think
I did anything wrong.
The end of the nugget season disappointed me.
And I thought, to be honest with you, the way that Michael Malone was talking about
it, he seemed disappointed in it, which I'm sure coaches always want their teams to play
well.
They weren't tanking or anything like that.
But he basically said more than once, if we don't shape up really soon, we're going to
get beat in the first round, let alone second, third, whatever.
We're not going to make it if we keep playing like this.
That included really ugly games.
Did they lose to the Rockets?
They almost lost to the Spurs.
They had a stretch where they lost five out of six or six out of seven.
And part of what bothered me with it was that Yogich would have, Yogich-type games
where he's nine of 12, nine of 13, whatever, shooting well, producing numbers.
But when they're in the clutch and in trouble, he's not the one taking shots, which maybe
there's postseason benefit to that to let other guys work through their stuff, to let
other guys feel like they get to take a big shot to Jamal Murray and everybody else.
There were moments where I wanted to see him take a little bit more on his shoulders from
a scoring standpoint.
We know he's efficient and we know he's capable of scoring when the going gets tough.
But there were so many times where I'm like, I wish he would do a little bit more from
a scoring standpoint because he makes the right play.
So often it did feel that way.
And so I've been wrong about that before from the standpoint of what does this mean for
this team as a contender?
I can't remember exactly what year was it was it 2018 or 2019?
One of the years where the Sixers were way too young theoretically to make a real serious
run at the finals.
But I remember when I was at 538, our model had them as being like one of the favorites
because our model at the time was kind of had a bias toward like how have you been playing
lately that was built into the model.
And the Sixers had won like 12 or 13 in a row with the week to go left in the season.
And it had them with a greater probability of winning the title than maybe even Golden
State at the time, which obviously was wrong.
And so maybe I haven't built in the same way that we've watched the Cavs do that with
LeBron where they just don't care.
They don't play any defense and then they make it back to the finals like they always
do.
So it's hard to pick up on that particularly when it's the first time that this team has
done that and they've been healthy.
And I think everybody was waiting to kind of crown them as the team.
They would have probably had that and when they didn't actually coalesce and look like
they're on the same page until the very end of all of it, I defaulted and said, okay,
if no one's going to really stand up and declare themselves, I'll take Phoenix.
Maybe the cohesion doesn't matter as much as I thought.
This series proved that that was absolutely wrong and they look ready.
I think it would be a fascinating.
So that'll be fascinating either way.
But if they get a rematch now with Golden State at full strength, you know, the team
that everybody kind of felt like showed how fraudulent Denver was last year.
Okay, you can't be fraudulent when you don't have Austin Rivers was getting started.
Exactly.
But I think it was one of those things where it was a self-fulfilling prophecy.
If you didn't think you'll get deserved MVP or what have you, you were going to use how
fraudulent Denver looked as a rationale, even though Yokech was playing his butt off, even
though Dremon gave Yokech total props for how much of a superstar the guy is.
So this just validates the fact that Denver was always real when they had these two, whether
you thought they were the favorite or not, you now see that they should at least be considered
one of them, if not the favorite.
They looked fantastic in this series, even if they didn't sweep or gentlemen sweep the
series, they were fantastic, even if Paul was out, they were fantastic.
I don't know if you guys watch or watched Game of Thrones, but there's a scene in one
of the middle scenes.
Yeah, we watched Game of Thrones, dude.
Come on.
I didn't watch it.
Don't assume.
You're right, but not assume.
I don't assume.
Excuse me.
I watched a lot of TV, but I'm not a big Game of Thrones person.
Go ahead.
Oh my God.
So there's a scene in one of the middle seasons where one of the men of the night's watch
stands up and says he will not serve Jon Snow and he looks around and I think he felt
he was going to have the protection of the mob there where a bunch of people would stand
up.
That's how I feel about Mark Jackson.
I feel like Mark Jackson.
There's a possibility that Mark Jackson thought there would be more than one person that left
the koliyokage off the MVP ballot and went that way.
Could be wrong.
Just the theory, you know, more likely than not, Mark's telling the truth.
He did have two forwards, a center, two guards.
Things do happen.
There's some gaffes on these ballots, but I couldn't help but think that maybe to lie
about it.
I mean, yes, there is.
Of course there is because you're on your own.
You have to explain why you left the koliyokage who just who by the way just kicked the crap
out of Phoenix yet why you left him off your ballot.
I mean, but what's going to fundamentally happen to him if he just owns it.
I feel like he probably did vote that way thinking that that was how it worked there.
I don't know why.
But my thought is like, is ESPN going to take him out of his?
I don't think that's going to happen.
No, no, they're going to take him out of it.
That's a tough one.
No, you can just be viewed as a hater at that point.
And I think that's fine too.
Like, I mean, Mark, but this is the equivalent of I got hacked, right?
Like the excuse like I got hacked.
It didn't sound that way.
It didn't sound that way a little bit.
Am I the only one who thought his apologies sounded like good?
I was fine.
He welcomed out.
Look, look, more likely.
And it was quick.
And it was quick.
And it was quick.
That's what happened.
But I will allow for the possibility that maybe Mark Jackson thought a few other people would
leave Nicole Hokech off the bat.
Yo, DeAndre Aiden is listening to this right now saying like, damn, Mark Jackson, he gets
the benefit of the doubt, but I don't.
No, not right now.
No, no, not after a year's worth of stuff with DeAndre Aiden that began right around this
time last year.
I'm Claire Crofton.
And in my new podcast, the Fighting Pucks, we're going out on the ice with the most violent
hockey team ever.
That was guerrilla warfare at its highest.
The Danbury Trashes wanted to win at any cost.
Big take down.
Big take up.
All done when breaking loose here in treasure cab.
He wanted to break every bone in his body.
Literally throwing him like a rag doll.
Going bananas.
Here at the Danbury Ice Arena, they can't restrain him right now.
So are they heroes or villains?
You decide.
I don't know what to say and I don't want to get shot.
There's the FBI side.
There's my side.
And somewhere in the middle is the truth.
Listen to the Fighting Pucks on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Pogcasts, or wherever you get your
podcasts.
You and I are going to have a problem.
Do you understand what I'm saying to you?
Welcome to the jungle.
Hey there, wrestling fans.
This is Freddy Prince Jr. and I'm excited to announce that wrestling with Freddy is coming
back for season 3.
Joining me once again is my awesome co-host Jeff Dye.
Together, we'll be highlighting the best matches of the week, giving you our expert
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the world of pro wrestling.
We're also bringing back our fan favorite, Sawed Quests, and adding some more fun stuff
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And of course, we'll be joined by some amazing guests.
So whether you're a longtime fan or just getting into wrestling, we have you covered.
So be sure to tune in every week, hit that subscribe button, and take that walk down
the aisle with us for all the action and excitement in wrestling with Freddy.
We can't wait to hear from you this season.
Listen to Wrestling with Freddy as part of the Michael Tura Podcast Network available on
the iHeartRadio app, Apple Pogcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Hey folks, this is Brent Reeves with MediaDers New Podcast.
This Country Life.
You ever wondered how to pick out a good dog, bowl up a mess of crawfish, or catch catfish
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Well, on this country life, I'm inviting you into my home where I'll teach you all of
that and more as I share my favorite stories of country living, rural America, and the
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In each episode, I'll be telling the story of a good hunt, a close call, a hard time,
a good time, whatever, and then I'll talk on some country skills that I think you ought
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Wherever you live, I think I've got a thing or two I can teach you.
Listen to this Country Life and the Bear Greece Feed on the iHeartRadio app on Apple
Pogcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
All right, last thing I want to talk about, the future of the Phoenix Suns.
It was about two months ago that I sat down in Matt Ishby's office in Phoenix and we talked
about the risks of putting this type of team together.
Matt Ishby looked me in the eye and said there are no risks with making this Durant deal
and putting this type of team together.
Well, you just saw what the risks are.
You have a 38 year old point guard who has a history of groin pulls and quad strains and
things like that that have kept him out of key moments in the postseason.
That happened again.
You have a player in DeAndre Aiden.
Let's, you know, let's go with what they say and being being hurt.
DeAndre was hurt during the year as well.
So him being out of the lineup shouldn't be all that surprising.
So now you entered the off season where all of a sudden we're talking about is Monty
Williams the right coach for this team.
We're talking about is Chris Paul going to be the point guard next year or they're going
to try to offload him and his partially guaranteed contract in favor of somebody else.
The best player on your team is going to be what 35 next year and has an injury history
of his own.
This was the risk.
The first row on this was the risk the sons took when they put this team together.
I never believed they were going to win this year because you just don't make a trade that
seismic and have it all kind of come together in the first postseason of your team being
together.
Not to mention the fact that he didn't even play games together play like three or four
games as a unit during the regular season.
I thought they needed a transaction cycle.
I thought they needed a full training camp, but they may need more like Chris Paul may
no longer be the guy.
You can't say they lost to Denver because Chris Paul was out the two games they won
didn't play in.
They may need some kind of significant upgrade and the problem is they don't have the assets
to go get it anymore.
They traded all them.
Brooklyn's got all them.
I think the sons are in kind of a perilous situation where it's going to take some craftiness
for them to get the right pieces for them to make a title run next season.
First of all, it pains me to say I got to commend Chris Manics after the trade deadline.
I came on his podcast and declared the sons a favorite in the West.
I thought they'd have a great chance to make the finals.
Manics said no road with the Lakers.
Yeah, Lakers.
Somehow, Lakers.
My pick's rule.
I'm not even prepared for how much we're going to hear if the Lakers come out of the
West.
Yeah.
I'm not even prepared.
So let me just get to Phoenix real quick because Manics is right.
This is a massive test for James Jones, who's had kind of an up and down tenure here in
Phoenix.
I think he's made some brilliant decisions and they've had some high profile misses as
well.
This is this is the biggest summer of his career as an executive to Chris's point.
Chris Paul is guaranteed for basically half his contract.
He's he's owed $30.8 million next year, only 15.8 of which are guaranteed, which means
he can be dumped.
He can be dumped to a team that's either going to have cap room.
Once again, look for Oklahoma City or someone like that to get involved because he can be
traded for and waived and that team will only take a $15 million hit.
Now again, the sun's going to have a lot of assets to kind of attach to Chris Paul there.
So it's not going to be simple to move him, but he's going to be movable.
I've had people reach out to each other.
They think this is Chris Paul's last run with this group.
It's no secret they were trying to move him at the trade deadline.
I'm not feeling great about his chances of staying with this team moving forward.
I think Monty Williams is another person who could be on the proverbial chopping block
here after another disappointing second round exit.
And then there's DeAndre and I will be completely floored if DeAndre and is on this team to start
next season.
He's someone who I think they desperately need to move for two rotation pieces.
You're not going to get great players in return for DeAndre and no, you're not the cap going
up.
And we'll say with the cap going up and him being a former number one overall pick, I
think there are teams that are going to be willing to take a chance on him, whether that's
Dallas, Detroit, Portland.
I think there are landing spots for him.
At this point, the sun's they don't need to hit a home run.
They need to hit a couple singles, a double.
They just need rotation bodies.
If they think you think the market for a disgruntled center who doesn't shoot threes
is is robust right now.
Look, I'm not.
You want to trade him for where you go bare, you could probably do that.
I think that Aiden.
Listen, if Russell Westbrook could get moved after his Lakers tenure for like three rotation
players, Aiden is still going to be 25 this summer.
He was a plus in the 2021 finals.
They were better with him on the floor.
You know, and he did a serviceable job against Giannis in the past.
He's had more success against you.
You could easily see an NBA team talking themselves into he'll get along with our coach.
He won't have to bump heads with Chris Paul.
You know, we'll create a better environment for him.
I'm not saying he's going to get a great return back, but I could definitely see an NBA
team talking to Minnesota.
Yeah.
That's a tough scene though, because it's like you're talking about a better environment
for him than Monty Williams, Chris Paul, Devin Booker.
Okay.
I mean, like there aren't that many better.
I mean, it looks like he was.
But I agree with you along with the money Williams.
No, no, no, I'm not saying that he did, but I'm just saying like who doesn't though, like
how many guys don't.
And I think that was that was why we talked about this so long.
It's like, no, he wasn't ever going to win the money.
Williams thing.
Monty Williams was coming off of a coach of the year award, a finals trip for a team that
hadn't made the playoffs the year before.
So I, I mean, someone will take a chance.
I'm curious to see what they'll yield to get them.
Minnesota.
Get another opportunity.
Man, Chris is a lot of hard.
I'm talking, I'm already talking myself into some version of Chris Paul and DeAndre Aiden
for Mike Conley and Rudy Gobert.
Like I'm already talking myself into that.
Like I can see Chris Paul ending up in Chicago just because the Lanzo ball thing is not clarifying
at any point.
Like they need a point guard.
Chicago doesn't care.
Yeah.
Yeah.
They'll take anything to stay reasonably.
And a name like I think they've always liked when they can get somebody with a name dating
back to the Duane Wade, the Jabari Parker stuff.
Like they've always been interested when they can get somebody that has some game left to
them.
Like what?
I don't think they can get him as a free agent.
I think they can get him as a free agent.
I think wave him.
I think that the team that trades for Chris Paul will wave him is my guess because they
can.
They can't give him $2 million savings.
Yeah.
I mean, I'm just in that part too, by the way.
Yeah.
With the same money.
Yeah.
Well, I do think that this was the year we saw a real decline.
Like we've seen, we thought we saw it in years past and Houston most notably.
Chris Paul did a phenomenal job of working on his body, getting his game right.
Tremendous in Oklahoma City.
Tremendous his first few years in Phoenix.
But this past year, whether it was the three point shot or the defense or the inability
to stay healthy, I think we've seen some decline.
I don't know though, Rowan, that you can just give him away.
Like I don't know that you can trade him for anything less than someone that's going
to replace him because campaigning it.
Like he's not the guy you plug in there to play next to Devin Booker and Kevin Durant
and that collection.
I don't know.
I don't know.
It's going to be complicated.
I've seen the Lakers float as a possibility.
They always will be, but I don't know what they would send back.
Like you do a sign and trade involved.
You do a sign and trade with Russell.
I don't know.
I could see it.
I think the Lakers would be crazy.
The Lakers are, if the Lakers win this series against the Warriors, they even touch that
roster.
They should all be cooked publicly for that because they've got something that works.
You don't need to bring in 48 year old Chris Paul when you have 27, 8 year old Daniela
Russell already there.
It would be, it would be a repeat of the mistakes they've made too, which is have a
good roster than trade for someone who doesn't make sense.
I just think that Phoenix needs, they just need like the KCPs of the world who, I mean,
every team wants them.
They're easier to get or easier to say to get them than to do it, but they don't need
to go star hunting, right?
They just, I think what this series showed is they just need capable rotation bodies.
We look at a guy like Bruce Brown, who I think his price has rightfully, Bruce Brown's price
has rightfully gone way up.
Boston zone.
He was available last year.
I'm here, he canes his own, Bruce Brown.
Those guys are out there, but like I said, it's going to be on James Jones.
He's has to identify the right talent, but again, they don't need to get a star.
They don't need to get someone at eight in salary at Chris Paul's salary.
They need to turn those contracts into two guys who aren't going to kill you in a playoff
series or aren't going to be as boomer bust as a Landry Shammit.
But even if they had like a Jevon Carter type who they used to have on the team ironically,
like those are the players they need to put around Booker and Durant.
I think they'll be in a better position moving forward.
Yeah, I just think it's going to be a challenge.
At some point Durant is going to stop being Durant.
I've seen some arguments that were already kind of there that he's not the superstar he
was as recently as last full year in Brooklyn.
So this again, this was the risk Matt Ischbyatuk.
He went all in.
He put all his draft picks.
He traded Michael Bridges.
He went out and got this superstar laden team.
And now you know, you can envision a scenario where they're once again battling for that
four or five seed next year.
And that's not what this new ownership group is paying for with this, this Phoenix Suns
organization.
So can I can I throw out a little, a little bit of a very early?
I mean, what if you call Utah up?
Do you think Utah is committed to Colin Sexton?
They could get off that contract.
Kelly O'Linnick, these are the kinds of guys I think they should be looking after.
These guys are not.
They're like Colin Sexton is not the answer with that team.
Like you want a guy that also needs the ball in his hands a lot to.
Yeah.
You know, this kind of a ball.
It's just, it's not look, it's not a, it's not a great place to be if you're Phoenix having
to make this decision.
They're tough.
And with the, with the new, I think, gosh, I wish I could credit the person.
It might even Kevin O'Connor.
So I'll have to find out who did it, but they're going to also be creeping up against
that second tax apron at some point in the near future.
You know, they have a ton of money committed to very few guys next year.
That's going to be another issue for them.
Another reason why I'm nervous about the CBA, but that'll be fascinating for them to figure
out.
It's tough, man.
I mean, where would you put Booker?
No, no less than what like the 11th 12th best guy in the league.
You've got two top 12 guys.
You've got a sitter that I still think most teams in the league would like to have, even
if he, you know, if we have questions about how committed he is or whatever else.
You're hearing that the Nets didn't want him.
I think that's didn't want him.
Like they were not looking for John Dred in that deal.
Like that to me is a red flag.
It is.
And what's so interesting about it is that with, again, Rohan pointed out that he was
more than serviceable.
He was legitimately good.
And the finals granted it was a couple of years ago.
I understand it more when we're talking about like a Ben Simmons and whether you want to
trade for him.
I remember the first time the hard and conversation came up that essentially Houston didn't want
Simmons back that that wasn't the and I understood it because with Simmons, he's got
so many really one key deficiency.
But it's a big enough one where it's like, okay, do you want to structure your team around
someone that can't do this?
I don't view eight and as being that limited.
Like you said, he's not really a guy that's shooting threes.
But he's better defensively than he gets credit for.
I don't think he took us a real step forward this year, which is unlike the other years
where you could have pointed to what he was doing.
He has shown that he can produce even when Chris Paul isn't there.
But he doesn't necessarily have enough to him where he's like, okay, Chris Paul's out
and we're not getting enough scoring from other guys.
I'm going to take it upon myself to go get you 40.
Like he's not that guy.
And I think that that's ultimately what you want when you're about to give up the farm.
I don't know what the farm is anymore.
The farm is like doubled in square footage over the last year when we're looking at teams
give up five picks or whatever fruit you go bare.
I don't know how many picks it would be.
But I think in order for it to make sense from what we're talking about, you need Aton to
be able to go get you someone to replace Chris Paul and functionally replace Aton's
spot two and maybe one more rotation guy.
And it is interesting in light of saying like, what's the market for him?
You're right.
If last year you couldn't convince Brooklyn to want him at a time where Brooklyn was trying
to reshuffle their deck, at least for a while they were before they called up the Katie thing.
It is going to be really fascinating to see what you get for him.
But really the return on Aton and maybe to some extent with Chris Paul if they don't
wave him if they trade him somewhere, that's the future of this team because you've got
an older Durant and you've got Booker and you traded.
Michael Bridges, obviously he looks really great right now with Brooklyn.
It's not to say they shouldn't have done it, but there were always risks involved with
that some of these problems are going to, these chickens are going to come home noose anyway
with the Chris Paul situation.
You kind of had until the end of his tenure with the sons that theoretically figure it
out before you've got to transition to something different.
We don't know how that will look, what that will look like, who they're replacing them
with, whether they keep Aton, but they've got some real, real questions to answer.
And it's part of the reason that it was really the same way we've talked about Philly, maybe
squandering a chance.
Phoenix had the bucks down two O in that series a couple of years ago.
And I thought about it more through that prism at the time through Chris Paul's prism of just
like, will he ever get this title?
And now to some extent you're asking the same question of will Katie get another one?
Can the sons win one at all despite the fact that they've got two top 10 top 12 guys?
It's a really unique sort of question to be asking question to be raising.
I got I got one more for you.
I got one more for you.
Fake trades.
Throw on here right now.
Yeah, I'm sorry.
Big brain.
On just one more here.
Aton and Chris Paul for Terry Rosier and Gordon Hayward.
No, no, no, no, no, if you're.
Because you have too many of the injury problems with Gordon Hayward Rosier.
I'm fine with taking on, but Gordon, he wants an expiring that maybe you can flip into something
else at the deadline.
Aala Westbrook.
I'll probably wait to see.
You guys are thinking about it.
You guys are thinking about.
Like Rosier.
I think Rosier is underrated.
I think he slots in well to a situation like that.
I don't like the Hayward that the person with the team that already has me injury concerns
is that team has.
My problem with the sons is that not the way without God Kevin Durant, because I agree
with the masses that say when you have an opportunity to get Kevin Durant, you go and
do it.
I just think that opportunity would have been there this summer.
I think they met the nets asking price when they didn't have to.
Like Kevin Durant wasn't going to be long for Brooklyn one way or the other.
The sons were always going to be in an advantageous position in part because Kevin Durant wanted
to be there.
In part because they did have a collection of assets be it young players, draft picks,
things they could do.
I think that three years from now when this story is kind of written is what maybe we
look back on.
Could the sons have just been a little more patient?
Matt Ishbia was not looking to be patient.
He was coming in looking to make a big splash.
He pushed this deal over the finish line in large part because he said, we can deal
Michael Bridges.
It's fine.
Let's go get Kevin Durant.
I think the great what if is going to be what might have happened if they did this deal
in June or July and were able to keep bridges and have bridges there alongside Durant alongside
Booker.
I mean, could they have really done it without bridges?
I feel like they wouldn't do it before.
But like it was close before they discussed the deal over the summer and look, it was
a lot super close.
Obviously didn't get done.
But I think there would have been a framework for a deal to get done that did not include
Michael Bridges.
That's just my read on it.
And part of that would have included pressure.
Brooklyn didn't feel any real pressure.
At least they weren't showing it over the summer.
They basically said, look, we're going to get the deal we want or else Kevin, you're
going to stick it out and we're going to see what Kevin Kairi and this group can actually
do.
Kairi was gone before the Kevin Durant trade happened and there would have been a lot more
pressure on Brooklyn this coming summer to do a deal because Kevin Durant would have said,
no, look, I'm out.
I'm really out this time.
It's not going to work with this team.
So look, I just think that's the great one.
If they'd be able to keep bridges, that's a game changer for this team.
All right.
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