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What's up, everybody? This is Suncane and Emilia Hartford. And this is our new podcast, Cars Stories. We get to bring you guys into our world, or maybe otherwise you will never get to meet these incredible people. We'll talk to people from all over the car community, including friends like Peter Brown, John Oates, Matt Farrah, and so many more. Listen to Cars Stories with Suncane and Emilia Hartford. Starting September 21st on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. It's The Crossover Sports Illustrates. NBA Show. Rigging down the latest news, rumors, and everything in between. Here's your host, Rohan and I, the comedian. Welcome back to The Crossover podcast. I'm Rohan Akroni, joining me on the show today is a senior writer at The Ringer. He left this show to podcast with a younger Indian person. It's our good buddy. Michael, the pod, Pina, Mike has it going. It's great. That intro is very professional, and then it just went off the rails into being unprofessional. I think it's Snap-on-Fingers. I think what you are taking as unprofessionals me presenting strictly facts. That was our two undeniable facts about the situation. I don't know. That's fair. Our listeners, the people who email us and DM us like, what happened? Deserved to know the truth. Deserved to know the truth. Mike and I are going to bring back a gimmick. I don't know what you want to call it. That you came up with. That you came up with two years ago. That I think is like someone would say the best podcast we've ever done. It was definitely the most contentious. We've had some contentious podcasts. We are going to rank the top 10 duos in the NBA. Surely we will be on the same page about that. But before we get into that, I want to talk about the Feebo World Cup, which Mike has been dutifully tweeting about at all three hours of the morning. Before you get into this, I don't do that. I've said maybe a total 15 tweets throughout the entire tournament. And that is two games. So I don't even know why I'm the subject of your eye. That is at least 15 more tweets and I've sent about it. And I'm pretty sure I saw, like, well, why isn't Michele Bridges cheating more this morning? Yeah, he should have shot more. I want to talk about the Feebo World Cup for a brief moment here, only because when did everyone have a secret meeting that I wasn't invited to about how we're going all in on the Feebo World Cup this year? And I see like, oh, like, look at this post upset from Slovenia and Serbia against them. Oh, JJ, I thought you were the defensive player of the year. Let's just call it what it is, okay? Team USA is not a basketball team. It is like, which 15 guys can we get to play in this tournament one month from now? That's what happened, okay? Calling them a basketball team is a very generous. USA basketball has not been interesting since 1992, okay? It was cool. The dream team was cool. All right. It's very simple. If they send the best American players, they will win. If not, realistically, it's obvious we don't care that much. And people are like, everyone's like, Steve Kerr, this is proved my coaching thing about him, blah, blah, blah. They lost my two points in the semi-finals with a fake team of guys who they're like, clearly the third or fourth choice. And everyone's making such a big deal out of it. I don't get it. And I'm tired of it. Well, I just wrote a column today about that loss in which functionally the thesis is that no one should care about this. So once again, I am not your enemy here. I don't know why I was bullied into that corner. But no, it's just people like basketball. And if you don't like basketball, then I don't know what to tell you, Rohan. Team USA has not been interesting since 1992 when you were even born. What is even going on? It's like we need a redeem team documentary. It's like, oh, you're telling me the team with LeBron, Wade, and Kobe want a gold medal? How cool. Just, just, I'm over it. I'm just over it. It's very simple. If they send the best basketball players, they will win. If not, like, who cares? Who cares? It's more interesting. It's also way more interesting when other countries win. It's like it's way more fun. Then you should be into this tournament. You should be into this tournament. Now I'm finally into it. For the first time in the whole summer, I'm into it. But people are like, oh, like, what these lineup decisions? And why isn't Brandon Ingram doing this? Or like, why? It's because it's not a real team. They just threw these guys together a month before the tournament started. Okay. So you're being very disrespectful to the competition right now. You're being an elitist. No, I'm happy for the competition. This is my preferred outcome. I'm just, I'm just like, when people are trying to dissect all the reasons why Team USA lost is we know why. I'll say, I don't think. No, this is a different podcast, but I don't think in the Olympics, you could just say if Team USA throws out the best players that they'll win. I don't think we're at that stage of the sport anymore. Do you think if we put Steph, book, Katie, LeBron, and AD on the Olympic team, you don't think they're coming back with goals? Steph, Steph, like, isn't going to play. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. No, since that's the only reason why is because we're not actually sending our like 10 best players. Even so, like, you know me. Give me Serbia. Give me your Gitch. Sure, absolutely. Give me your book. Give me your book. Give me your book. I think you mean, I'm sorry. I think you're confused. I think you mean Yovic. Is the name you're actually looking for there? You missed it. If you didn't, I woke up at 4.30 today. I was watching Yovic. Where's your commitment? Good. Good. Learn the game. Future Portland Trailblazer. Is he on the Blazership? I've been sleeping also. I think he's off the table now, apparently. So anyway, let's not get to sidetracked here, because I do want to get into our top 10 duos ranking. And I'm going to let you go first. I know you love to have like 10 honorable mentions. I was literally about to say, can we do honorable mentions first? Yes. Or do you want to say them? Should we actually say them for the end? Because then it kind of takes a little bit of the spice out of it? Sure. So let's do one dishonorable mention before we start. One duo that was previously on the list that I'm sick of, that I'm like, that I'm like, don't talk to me about this duo ever again. And that's Joel and Beat and James Harden. I'm just, I'm done with both of you. Unserious. Can I, can I tell you what Sixers take? I've been brewing on, by the way? Sure. If Joel and Beat was as good as Sixers fans say he is. And if Tyrese Maxie was as good as the Sixers fan office says he is. They would trade James Harden for the Clippers spare parts. Because, I mean, if Amid is better than Yogech and Tyrese Maxie is as budding All-Star. I don't remember the nuggets being this three headed All-Star juggernaut. No one had Aaron Gordon as, you know, what, a top 30 player in the NBA before last year. If Amid is this, is the MVP, this two-way dominating force that everyone says is better than Yogech. Why do they need a third star? Why do they need, you know, another James Harden type of Tyrese Maxie is waiting in the wings? I just think it's a, it's a little revealing how high the bar is when they have to trade James Harden for. I'm just going to say I agree. You know, I don't really want to go to. We could, yeah. I would say I agree. It's a great take, great take. Thank you. Thank you very much. All right, Mike, do you, so you, you want to save your honorable mentions? Yeah, let's save the honorable mentions because there's some on here that maybe people would think that you or I have on our top 10s. And so let's jump. You want me to go first? Yes, please. Give me your, your 10th best duo in the NBA. John Marant and Jerry and Jackson Jr. And before we go too much further into this exercise, let me just say like in terms of the ranking process, how did you balance out just pure talent versus like two teammates who complement each other and are, like the sum is better than the two guys who make the sum better than individual parts the most. How did you kind of figure that out? It's a great question. It's a real, it's a, me, it's a wild mixture of who do I really enjoy watch playing? It was an important part of my list. One part of it was like, what I want this duo in NBA Jam, like what this would be in the NBA Jam duo. Okay. Another part of it was do they win? Do they win? Do I feel like this duo wins? Do they kind of like, do they strike fear into other teams as a duo? And then another part of it was availability, because I'm going to be honest. Let's get spicy off the top. Can I talk about my 10 yet? Like what's... Yes, you can, you asked me a question before you said before we get into it. I could sense, I could sense you were about to take a left turn that would just throw everything off the rails. Well, I'm just going to say John, JJ, JJ, didn't make my list. Okay, that's fair. That's perfectly, there's a lot of do-os. A lot of do-os. Yes, and a big huge part of that is Jaws got the suspension. And also the Grizzly starting five has played 160 minutes together last year. Again, that's not their fault specifically, but the starting five that they've had the last years that's been really good has in fact barely played together. So they're on like a probationary period for me. But anyway, you can go ahead and talk about John, JJ, JJ. What I'll say is they played over 800 minutes together last season. And that's a low number. And Jaws had his issues. And Sharon Jackson Jr. started the season with an injury. They're net rating when they were on the court together. And I looked up the net ratings in the regular season and the playoffs for all the do-os that I have ranked in my top 10. And there's this plus 14.5 in the regular season, which is absolutely an absurd number. So I initially actually had these two as an honorable mention. And then as I was kind of, you know, going through it and looking at some of the data and just thinking deeper about it because you were late for this podcast. And I had some extra time to spare. It's just like Jaws amazing. I get the idea of suspenders going through some stuff. Jaws amazing. Sharon Jackson Jr. is the reigning defensive player of the year. And like they make so much sense together. You got the pick and roll, pick and pop. Sharon Jackson Jr. makes up for so many of Jaws deficiencies in the defensive end. And when you have a big, who can space, who's got great hands, who can score in the post. I just think like they harmonize well. I gave them the nod plus they do win a lot of games. Yes, yes. Listen, they're good. It's on a sale. I have no issues with that. They're like a true honorable mention for me. I just looking ahead to the season, just the Jaws suspension. It played a big role in this for me. Even though people are going to say I'm hypocritical when I get further into my list. And that's why it's my list. But yeah, no, they're great. What have you made of? I know I just went on this whole fever rant. But there's been a lot of JJJ discourse. How do you feel about it? Because we were like, he's now he's fouling too much. You only had one foul today. Maybe the key is him fouling. That's been a reason they've been successful. But do you think that that is like a? It is frustrating. I mean, you know, the grizzly sense come back with all of this. This is the number of times he's actually had five fouls, et cetera. To me, the bigger issue is when he picks up those early fouls and has to come out like. His minutes for game is like not particularly high for a player of his talent. What do you make of it just the foul discourse? Yeah, I mean, I think there's something to it. And it's slightly overblown. I did not have him first for defensive player of the air on my ballot. I had dream on green. And just famously. If it was a per minute award, then sure. Per minute, he was killer, but you're right. He didn't really play enough. I thought relative to some of the other really great defenders in the league. You know, I mean, just watch his overall play has not been like good in FIFA. So beyond the fouling. And I think maybe he's potentially in his head a little bit. It's become so much ingrained with his narrative as a player, which is unfortunate. Super skilled. Love so much about him. He was asked recently by Memphis Grizzly social media team. Who's the best player in the NFL? And he responded to Tibo, which I thought was really funny. So love, Sharon Jackson Jr. And yeah, I hope he just is a little bit more disciplined on that. And I'm sure he will be as he goes throughout his career. So my number 10 duo. And I don't even necessarily love this duo. I have to show them respect for what they did last year. Once I got the duo, that was the driving force of statistically, the best offense in NBA history. And that's deer and fox and demand to subonus. Who even though I think subonus was a little bit exposed in that playoff series against Golden State. I think frankly outplayed by Cavan Looney. I don't think you can argue against that. What they did in the regular season last year. Well, nobody stopped on Looney's chest. That's true. That's true. And also not to be people forget guy on a podcast, but subonus played the entire second half last year with the messed up thumb that he could have gotten surgery on. And he said, no, I'm going to play. And I have a lot of respect for that. And you want to talk about duos. This isn't just like the two best players on the team. It's they are doing everything together. And that's the driving force of their success. The pistol actions they run. I mean, the speed at which they play within the half core. It's a ton of fun to watch. It really is. They were awesome last year. So 910 is fox and subonus. Even though I think I'm hoping that the subonus we saw on the first round against the Warriors is the kind of playoff series that motivates him to add more to his game. Instead of being the kind of playoff series, that's kind of a sign of things to come in his career. They were an honorable mention for me. Really nothing bad to say about them. I just thought that 10 other. It's just really tough. There's a lot of people actually go through and look at the duos in the NBA right now. It's just insane talent. So they're great. Really benefited from health last year, which is one reason to, if you're down on the Kings this upcoming season, that would be why they had a lot of health luck. Maybe they don't get that this year. We'll see. But yeah, best offense ever. And Fox was just such an animal in the playoffs. I was just excited to see them play in meaningful basketball games. Fox's career was kind of going the other way. I mean, there's people who thought they should have kept Halliburton over him. And yeah, it was just awesome to see them. Fox was, I mean, if he doesn't get hurt in that series, maybe they do end up winning it. Sure. Man, that was a fun series. Alright, so that's my number 10 duo. Let me hear your number nine. It's in Beaton Harden. I'm sorry. Come on, dude. What a year. You don't want to be. I can't. Okay, dude. I can't have the league. I like, you know how I feel about all this stuff, because we text frequently. I can't have the league MVP and, you know, a former toot. How many MVP is a certain one? He won one. Players should have won two. And one media. Okay. Remember when the players voted on their own awards for like two years? Yeah. That was terrible. Like, you know, together they had a really good regular season. Harden, you know, we talked about like complementing each other. Harden assisted in beat 244 times last year, which was 90 more than any other duo. So their pick and roll makes a lot of sense. Really hard to stop unless you're the boss in Celtics. And yeah, it's just that they're really good, talented, uh, tandem. And so I had to have them somewhere in the list. And I apologize to you. They would have been high on this list for me. If they didn't, the game's seven loss of skiers, even though people do talk about it, how much of a just flagrant choke job, game six of the Eastern Conference semi-finals was? Like, and be not even like shooting. I think he took one shot in the last four minutes. P.J. Tucker needing to get into say, so like, bro, you can't keep passing out of single coverage against Al Porford. Even though he probably should have, because Al Porford was clamping his ass. That was one of the more disgraceful duo performances. I've seen in the last few minutes of a basketball game in such a long time, like rivaling Kauai and P.G. in the bubble, which frankly came under such different circumstances. You are at home. Jason Tatum's having the worst game of his life. And you can't close it out. That was to me, just unforgivable, a despicable performance that should follow them around until one of them is like, you know, they have to bury that one deeply with some kind of playoff run to take the stench off that. I mean, they've got some performance. And they might not even need to do all this. Yes. What's up, everybody? This is Sun King. And Emilia Hartford. And this is our new podcast, CAR Stories. We get to bring you guys into our world and our community where maybe otherwise, you would never get to meet these incredible people. Including friends like Peter Brown, who did all the sound design for the Fast and Furious movies. CARs are a fantastic opportunity to be an extension of the characters in the film. The more weird character that I can get into a car, the better. And then we also get to talk to Matt Farrah, the Wikipedia of CARs. This truck was wild. It was really a two-seater, but it had eight cup holders for two people. We also have John Oats. Jordana Brewster. Jesse E. Wuji. Rod Amory. And so many more. Listen to CAR Stories with Sun King. And Emilia Hartford. Starting September 21st on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Because even if you're not a gearhead, everyone has a CAR story. I'm a seeded king, a king. What's good, y'all? It's your main man, Michael Smith, a steamed NFL analyst and certified fantasy football legend. Allow me to present to you your new favorite fantasy football podcast. The Dynasty Exchange, hosted by my first round rookie picks, Davis, Dylan, and Josh. Three guys who most definitely know their stuff. They're the co-commissioners of the coolest and most cut-throat dynasty league you'll ever come across. The Yacht Club. And now they're the co-hosts of the most elite. Now make that the definitive Dynasty program in the game. It's dedicated to only the most devoted of die hearts. The guys like me who can't stay off sleeper in KTC. And trust me, you won't regret making the choice to follow their Dynasty advice. Listen to Michael Smith presents The Dynasty Exchange on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Fantasy Football fans. The NFL season is here and now is the time to get ready to dominate your leagues. The best way to crush your opponents this season is to listen to the NFL Fantasy Football podcast. Come hang out with me, Marcus Granth, and my pal Michael F. Florio as we give you all the info you need to absolutely steamroll your fantasy league and bring home a championship. You don't need to spend hours each day breaking down every stat and every stitch of game tape to set a winning lineup. That's our job. We'll provide all the insights you need to set the best lineups each week. All you need to do is listen to the NFL Fantasy Football podcast when it drops five times a week. If you're looking for a smart, fun, and entertaining path to dominating your fantasy leagues, then look no further than the show straight from the source at NFL Media. Do it before it's too late. Subscribe now and listen to the NFL Fantasy Football podcast on the iHeartRadio app on Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Okay. My number nine duo. This is like a hedge. It's Kauai Leonard and Paul George. It's disrespectful. Continue. They don't play. Jerry West don't play. Don't play. Paul George's podcast and said to his stays, you don't play enough. That's well with Kauai Leonard. And I just... It's been like years since they've played in a playoff series together. They've been years since they've finished a playoff series together. I just... They're like, who... If you told me, ask me, who's going to play more minutes together this year? Hardener and Beat are quiet PG. I don't know who I would be. Just... Okay, stop. Just settle down. Please... Please settle down. They were not... They played 1,000 minutes together last year. Like, just... You know, it's not like they... They're hurt 100% of the time. Like, let's... It's just like two-time finals MVP, one of the best players ever. Um... Yes, quite. Yes, quite. It does a great job in the playoffs when he's playing against a team on its last legs. You love... Wow. No, no, no. I love... I love playoff Kauai. No, I just want to see it. I just want to see it, Mike. Like, it's... It's too rare for me. I just... I have zero faith in them staying healthy at this point. They're only getting older. They're only getting older. They're only getting older. I... What are they? 32 and 31. Like, let's... Come on. I'll just keep it in calm down. It's okay. It'll be fine. It'll be okay. Kauai... Kauai is out here hoping on like, Joe Biden's knees. That's the... I... Um... Like... I need to see a video of him walking up onto the team's private plane. I need to... I need the video of it to before I'm moving them any higher. I listen. They are awesome in theory and it's very exciting when they do play together. It just doesn't happen enough for me. So, that's my number nine. And I'm sticking with it. Okay. Um... I'm not going to tell you where I had... Kauai and PGA. I'll just... We'll get there. Yeah, we'll get there. So, you can tell me your number eight duo then. So, my number eight is... It was a little... It's a little tricky. Maybe you can settle this. I have one player down. His name is Janus Santacumpo. Hmm. And then I don't... I have Drew Holiday as his... co-pilot, I guess. Just because Middleton's whole health situation is very tenuous and Drew plays a ton. They played a ton together last year. They... Drew rarely gets hurt. Um... I know during the championship run, it was mostly like the Middleton Janus pick and roll. So, it was... This was tough for me to kind of figure out. But I had holiday... Holiday is the... Yeah. Natural... Uh... other part of this Tussum and... Yeah. I don't know. Janus is great. And Drew's awesome. They totally flamed out in the first round together Drew Holiday. Uh... You know... Great... Great defender. Brutalized. That was the name. Like... A comfortable facet. As I was watching it, I was like, this is a little mean. Like... I don't know that I... It's not said that it's a big Jimmy Butler fan. I was like, this is a little mean. But when I... When I watched Drew, honestly, like... I've always thought... You know, the... The thing about Drew is always like... He's on... He most underrated player in the league. That's like... That's like what people have said about him forever. And I have a lot of respect for him. I do think the defense is legit. Of course. Um... I think... I've always thought... Or have thought for the last couple years, at least, that his offense is overrated. Particularly in the playoffs. Particularly in the playoffs. Yes. But I just think his like decision making is like... Yes. Wacky sometimes. I mean, he's had games where he's like... It's like, dude, why are you taking 28 shots? Because you're making seven no matter what. You can take seven or 28 and you're making seven. Like... Yeah, he's super physical. I just think like sometimes if he were to tone it down and take a step back a little bit, he'd be more efficient and more effective given who else is on his team. But... Yeah. So they're eight here. I had to... I had to put you on this. I mean... Yeah. One of the best players of his generation. Even though I know deep down you're a Yannis Hader. It's true. So they pop up later on my list. And I also picked Drew. I think Middleton was tough last year, man. I mean, the heat... I know Jimmy was kind of just... Who knows what got into him in that series? And as you said, he was going after Drew. It was like he was succeeding in the Drew in a way that he had to to win that series. But he was targeting Middleton in a way that it was like... You were not doing that two years ago and they were making it to the finals. I don't know if it's just... He never fully recovered from that knee injury that allowed Boston to make the finals that one year. But it just... Hopefully a full off season. I don't know what it takes, but... They're in a weird spot, man. The Bucks are in a weird spot. So I agree with you. I do think Drew. Was there any party that thought Brooke Lopez? No. Okay. But they'll pop up on my list soon enough. But my number eight duo... Don't even Mitchell and Darius Garland. Oh my god. Wow. I'm not giving up on Mitchell and Garland. Oh wow. Here's the thing. Cleveland was... Fantastic during the regular season last year. Yep. And we had so many questions about their defense. When was defense ever their problem? Like, even in that mixed series, that was a slugfest. Scoring was a bigger issue for them than the defense side of the ball. I think that they need... You know, they tried to address the three spot, get some shooting this summer. You said this, and I agree. They still need, I think, a better two-way player in that spot. They still need a defender to take wing guys, unless I would mowbly, grows into that player. I do think, eventually, they're going to have to move off Jared Allen, which I think could still yield them the kind of player that they're looking for. But, I mean, Cleveland... Did they end up finishing last year with the number one net rating in the NBA? Like, Cleveland was fantastic during the regular season, and they just ran into a particularly bad matchup in the playoffs, like getting pounded on the offensive glass in particular, Mitchell Robinson, turning into a chemologian one. But, I don't know. I just... I still have faith in this duo, and I think that they were better in their first season than I thought they would be. So, why did you go those two, as opposed to, like, mowbly? Because I actually had mowbly as an honorable mention with Mitchell. I think mowbly will be that guy. I don't think he's that guy yet. I thought that they looked their best in the playoffs, in fact, when Garland was really aggressive. Like, I think that if he'd looked for his shot a little bit more, hunted Brunson a little bit more, that could have been a little bit better series for them. I still... I think mowbly is eventually going to be that guy, maybe, even their best player, but for now, I still think it's Mitchell and Garland that kind of make them go. Mm-hmm. Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, without mowbly, those two don't really work on the defensive end. He was so important. And he played so well. For sure. That's a great point. I don't disagree with that. So, yeah, that's low-key spicy. I mean, that's a very good duo. Just a little masala, you know? I try to keep it interesting. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. I like it, though. They had the second best... They had the second best net rating in the NBA last year. Best defense. Best defense. Best defense. And they were closer... I mean, they were way closer to number one than Philly was to them at number three. I mean, Philly was... The gap between three and six was the same as the gap between one and two. So, Cleveland was just really good last year when those guys were healthy. They were. All right. This is where we're going to probably start to argue. Oh my gosh. I mean, number seven. It's Jimmy. It's Jimmy. It's Jimmy. This is a joke. I mean, this is a joke. I mean, this is an absolute joke. Seven... Dude, the six duos that I have in front of them are all lights out. They're very, very good. This is embarrassing. Even for you, this is embarrassing. This is... This is absolute Boston media mafia. This is a joke. Dude, I'm not going to address them until I get to where they are on my list. Because that's when they actually deserve to be discussed. Because we don't have them right now. It's just embarrassing. I have nothing but positive things to say about them. I don't know why you're being so negative. Jimmy, amazing. Bam, amazing. For obvious reasons, both two-way players had a really productive playoff run. Plus one, when they're both in the court, net rating in the postseason, played more minutes than any other duo. That's okay. You know, plus one is not anything to write home about. Plus 4.2 in the regular season. Okay. That's just like... How about... Relatively speaking. How about... Okay. No, no, no. I'm not even going to get to it. Again, I'm not going to get to it until I need to get to it. Because this is a joke. Okay. My number... My number 7 duo is Yannis and Juru. Okay. Yeah. I mean, we touched on them. You know, that's Yannis doing a lot of the heavy lifting there, certainly. I loved Drew Holiday, but I agree. The offense is too inconsistent for them to be higher. Not to mention, again, they've now one and two, despite as the number one seed against Jimmy and Bam in the playoffs. So... Never having... And like... If you put Bam next to a broke Lopez, if you... I'm not going to get into it. We'll get into it. We'll get into it. But my number 7 is Yannis and Juru. Let's move on to number 6. As I go down here, I want you to tell me which of these duo's just clear cut. And you can make an argument. I'm not like saying that Bam and Jimmy have to be number 7. I just think it's a respectable place to put them. It's not. But okay. So number 6 is Anthony Davis and LeBron James. Hey, we're... We are first... Our first... Yatsi or Bingo. I got them. I got them as number 6 too. So I knew this would totally hijack the entire plot. Of course, yes. But explain to me why Jimmy and Bam are better than LeBron and Anthony Davis. First of all, I think Bam is still the best defender in the NBA. And I think it's absurd that you guys had your little click vote. Who is you guys? Defensive player of the year, two years ago. The people who voted Marcus Mark. Defensive player of the year, two years ago. That's you guys. So over 50 people who do not communicate and vote independently. That's a lie. It's you, Fandool, and the Boston media mafia colluding to get Marcus Mark the player of the year. I mean, first of all, LeBron and AD, like as good as they are, needed multiple roster overhalls to get to where they were last year in the playoffs because they couldn't carry a mismatch roster. You are sitting here. You are chief. I don't believe in the Lakers. You thought their deadline was trash and you picked them to get swept in the first round. So I don't know why you're now. It's something like, oh, LeBron and AD, so good. They've been so inconsistent together, frankly. AD, again, this whole, I don't want to play center thing. I just don't think they've maximized each other's talent since that first year together. They're both in and out of the lineup. I have my doubts about both of them being healthy for an entire playoff run. And even though on paper, the duo is so tantalizing, the results have not been there. So I don't know why they should be any higher. I don't know what they've had less playoff success to me than most of the guys ahead of them. And on a pure talent standpoint, like LeBron's in year 21, he's still obviously incredible. But I just, if I'm starting a team to win this season, I would rather have all the duo as I have ahead of them if I'm trying to win a title is where it comes down to for me. Really? Yeah. I would say AD was the best defender. You just call it BAM the best defender in the NBA. Debatable point. BAM's amazing. Love BAM. AD had the best defensive run in the playoffs. Would you care to quibble? Or he was like lights out. I mean, as you put it, protection was incredible. As you put it, they played the Memphis hustle and round one. They did. They did. They didn't have an actual big man to throw at him. He was fantastic in the Warrior series. There's no question about it. But like if Clay Thompson makes two more threes, like that's a, you know, he was fantastic in the playoffs. There's no question about it. They also, you know, no, I, no, I recall BAM going up against a 100% healthy, honest and decoupo for an entire playoff series, 100% healthy Chris Middleton for an entire play. I mean, just, just say it. Just stop it. I'm saying. I just, he's, he, he is. That's a thing. AD has the potential to be the most destructive defensive force in the NBA. But I don't think he's at that level consistently enough. Okay. I mean, that's fair. That's fair. I still think when he's healthy and when he's, and to your point, he's not always aggressive, but neither is BAM offensively like. If I'm stacking these two guys up next to each other, it's just basketball players. The ceiling for AD is higher than it is for BAM. That's just. I agree. And there was a few, there was a few years we thought AD was maybe going to win multiple MVP's, but he just had it in that guy. He has not been that guy. And he's doing himself a disservice by this, this power forward stuff like I get it. It's not easy, but it's part of the problem too. And then like, you know, healthy LeBron, we're, we're assuming all these guys are healthy when we're making these lists, right? For the most part, yes. So healthy LeBron versus healthy Jimmy is, I'm not saying it's obvious that LeBron's better because actually I, I don't necessarily think that on some days at the stages of their career. I think Jimmy was a top five regular season player last year. I think his regular season's actually underrated because of how well he was, how well he played in the playoffs last year. But you look at a lot of the advanced metrics had Jimmy as like a top three guy in the regular season last year when he played. When he played, that is true. And but I would, I'd still bet on his health more than LeBron. Uh, sure. I mean, given the fact that LeBron's about to turn 40. Yeah. So fair statement. Yeah. I just, you know, I would say despite how poorly LeBron played in the playoffs, particularly with his outside shooting and A.D.'s, you know, had the jumper in the bubble, then Lord knows what happened to his outside shot. I think these duos are actually really comparable in the fact that, um, they need shooting beside each other. Like that, that is, uh, and some of these other lists that I have here, they don't, you don't need a lot around to bit like specific tools around, um, the two players that we're talking about to construct a key lineup. So like, I just think like to be fair, um, you know, Jimmy's not, Jimmy can hit threes and doesn't really choose to take a ton and bam, it's not a three point shooter at all. And that's not the be all end all of this conversation. But I do think that that matters a little bit. And the variability of the three point line was such a big factor in Miami's playoff run too. So, um, so yeah, that's just, but, but it's funny. Because we both do have them at six. I mean, yes, we can quibble about who we have above and below them. But I do think that's instructor of the fact that like, I think we both feel like they're leaving some, they've left some stuff on the table over the course of their partnership. I think it's the ultimate takeaway from them. Absolutely. Yeah. Uh, is it, is it me for five? Yeah. Sure. You want to give me your five? It's Kauai MPG. Um, I mean, I get it. Yeah. Kauai is the best. Like, I don't, I, you know, Yokech is actually the best. You just, you keep letting Kauai like, it's, you just, you keep going back to no matter how poorly he treats you. I don't, I don't care. I don't, I really don't care. Like, I watched the first two games of clippers, clippers, clippers, he's the first two games. He is like a by far. It's not even like, oh my god. Like, it's a real toe to toe battle here with him and KD who's KD's like top 15 point of all time. And it's like, no, actually, Kauai is better. Just look at, Kauai is just manhandling this entire team, like doing whatever he wants for two straight games. Like he was, he was the first game in particular. It was just like a masterclass. Incredible. It was a masterclass. Incredible. He didn't have PG. He didn't have PG. And then you need the SpongeBob a few moments later. It's him in a suit, um, watching the playoffs, like, like, he don't play his, um, so I love them. I love them, but I just, can I get one full playoff run from them? Just one, um, um, um, before I put them in my top five, um, you can do whatever you want. Yeah. Um, I just like, I would probably still have, I would have them like two, um, if it wasn't for all the injuries, so like me dropping them to five is like my, my get back, yeah. Right. Are you ready for my number five? I am. I have Jalen Tadeau, Jalen Brown and Jason Tadeum, it's my fifth best duo in the NBA. So unlike you, baby, I'm not gonna, you know, throw a, a, a, a temper tantrum here. Here's, here's something I'm gonna say, you're dead wrong. Let me throw something at you in orange, yes, yes. If the, if the heat and Celtics agreed to trade Jimmy and Bam for Jason and, and Jalen, I think it, like, bro, no, I would not want that. No, no, no, I'm not saying, I'm not saying you'd want it. I'm saying if you gave Jimmy and Bam Tadeum and Brown supporting cast, I, I think they, they are winning a title easily, easily, easily. If you put Bam next to Al Hoerford, if you gave Jimmy the three point shooting, you didn't, the Celtics had last year instead of what Vincent and Struth, they do, if you gave Jimmy the three, okay, see, this is like, they were, okay, but they were starting Kevin Love in the Eastern Conference Finals. Yeah. Dude, he puts in the conversation, he has a rotation. I'm just saying they, I think that they've done more with less talent over the last four years than Brown and Tadeum, and I don't think you can argue with that, I really don't. I am not going to say that, well, first of all, I will say that people like to have their cake any to two when they're analyzing the Celtics and they're saying this and that about the flaws that Marcus Smart has, but oh, wait, when they trade Marcus Smart, how are they going to, they just lost like their leader, like this guy who's just their whole, their toughness, but at the same time, mentally weak team, how do you fall down with three, third drop, two home games in the Eastern Conference Finals to the Miami Heat? So, I hear a lot of people talking about, I don't both sides of their mouth when they talk about the Celtics, I didn't know that, like, you know, Derek White was going to the Hall of Fame, all of a sudden, he's a really good player. I mean, you did, you've always loved Derek White, so you've always been high on Derek. No, I like all these players, but a lot of them are, like, their role players, I get it, I think, I think White Smart, Horford, who am I forgetting, White Smart, Horford, Rob Williams, all these guys, I think, would be the third best player on the heat, and would have been in that playoff series, which, which heat guy are you taking over them after Jimmy and Bam? Whatever happened to, whatever alien being went into, Caleb Martin's body, give me that. No, no disrespect to him, he's awesome. Of course. Yeah, he'd listen, but that's another thing, when people, this is a thing that's bothered me about the heat conversation, people are like, oh, Caleb Martin did XYZ, it's like, is he supposed to miss those shots? Like, I don't get it, it's like, the guy played great, like, you have to do something about it. This idea that everyone's going to play to their averages all the time is also, I think, to me, like, a silly way to think about it, like, the three point shootings are different conversation, but, you know, it's like, those Caleb Martin games have, they aren't, they aren't fake, just because they're like, atypical, it doesn't mean they're a fluke necessarily either. Um, I just, yeah, I just think Jimmy and Bam have done a lot of heavy lifting with the roster that, frankly, has not been great, um, like Gabe Vincent was obviously very good. Caleb Martin's obviously very good. All these guys were on the scrap heap of the NBA, Struce, Kevin Love, Kevin Love wasn't even in the cabs rotation anymore. All these guys were on the fringe, but they played, they all played well, like, that's just a narrative. What they actually did on the court was they played really good basketball, but then up to go to the NBA finals. And, uh, but I think a lot of that has to do with Jimmy and Bam, frankly, and what out, of course, those are the two best players. And I just think if you swap them, I think that we're looking at Jimmy and Bam way differently because I think that if they had, even if you gave Jimmy and Bam Brooke in Middleton, that would be a huge upgrade over what else they have in their rotation. Um, so they don't get spout anymore? I mean, do you guys are telling me for years, Brad? No, I'm just not just asking. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Wrestling isn't even a coach anymore, so did they get spout? Do they get to bring spout and, you know, the versatile defensive genius and the zone is that do they get to cap that to or a coach who let's play and play point guard like all these things? Like, do they, do they get that? Or yes, they get that. Yes, yes, and maybe it should have been, you know, Jimmy and Spowe is the duo, but I just, I think that they've done so much more with so much less than all these teams. Okay, let's, let's reframe pure talent, Jalen Brown, Jimmy Butler, Jason Tatum, Bama DeBio, how are you raking those four players? I, I genuinely believe this is not takeory. I would take Bama over Jalen Brown, just because of the defensive versatility and like people like Bama, unaggressive offensively, blah, blah, blah, 20 point per game score last year averaged, compare what he averaged in the finals versus what Jason Tatum averaged in his first final as well. I just throw that out there. You do, real quick, you do understand the, the way that the Denver Nuggets defended Bama DeBio is please shoot the basketball and that is not the way that the Golden State warriors are better defensive team. I get it. I get it. Where I get it. I get it. But people are like, well, they want Bama to take those shots he did and he, and he hit them a lot and it was, and they were successful when he was shooting. So the question here comes down to Jimmy versus Tatum. And I see, I see the argument, I just don't know how you separate them. I really don't. I really don't. I mean, after this year, I do put, okay, I think one's better than the other, but I don't, I don't think it's, again, I don't think this is like super obvious. This is not. That's why I separated them. This isn't Yoage vs. BS, you know, this is why I separated them by one spot and listen, if Brown and Tatum got it done, I would have put them over Bama and Jimmy. No question. I put them over the two years ago when we did this, but dude, Bama and Jimmy, people can talk about the honest injury, blah, blah, blah, Jimmy snatched the soul out of that Bucks team, them making it to the finals is an eight seed. They've made the finals as a fifth seed at an eight seed. They're two and one against the Bucks now, two and one against the Celtics now. The proofs and the results. That's what it is to me. Those playoff wins since 2019, think about all the guys that teamed up in 2019, LeBron and AD, Kawaii and PG, eventually we get hardened and imbued, all of these playoff duos, Jimmy and Bama, more finals appearances and more playoff wins. I don't know, it's never been an easy road for them. Listen, we did this pod last year before that Celtics heat series. We both did not really think the heat had a chance. Then pushing it to seven was unexpected, frankly. It still came down to that butler shot. I just think they have overachieved and therefore I have them over-challenged in Jason. Number one seed home, game seven, don't lead for a second and they're under-achieving or over-achieving. Okay, no, that's fine. That's not a big deal. Okay, so greatest team ever in the second half, once everyone got one's problems, blah, blah, blah. It's come on, man. Well, I thought they had this flawless supporting cast, which is it? I don't understand. I'm confused. They do. That's why they were so good last year and they made the finals. Even though they only made it because Middleton got her, but anyway, who's your, did you give your number four? My four is Tatum and Jalen, highest paid player in the NBA. Can we talk about, wants to make, wants to make Boston the Black Wall Street just- Can we talk about the- It's aspiration. It's our track for a second. I don't really want to, but- Well, I'll say what you're about, like, what did people think was going to have? Like, what was the, what was the freaking alternative? Like, okay, Jalen Brown, we're going to take less money, yeah? Like, just get, like, everyone get a grip. You know how the NBA works. People are like, you're going to give Jalen Brown the highest contract in the NBA history. Until the next guy signs, like, two months from now, like, just, just stop, like, the I, here's the word, here's what I'll say. The idea of breaking them up when they are also, like, one game seven away from having the most flat wins or most finals in the next two years, like, just give me a break. Yes. It was very good. They lost to the freaking warriors in the finals, like, what, what, what, like, that I, as much as I think, band and journey genuinely deserved to be ahead of them on this list, the discourse around Brown and Tatum, absurd. And I say that as someone who has no respect for the Boston medium, off you have no. But the way people talk about them is just, it's, it's silly. It's actually silly. Well, that was big of you coming from someone who has spent months texting me that Jalen Brown was out of here and he had played his last game. Oh, he means when the season ending, he's not finishing this contract in Boston. That's a different question. It's just the real question is if him and Tatum go to the Lakers together, or if they stagger it, it's, it's, that's the, just ridiculous, that's, isn't Jalen Brown in the big three? Does he even still play in the NBA? He's the best player in the history of the big three, better than he is. So before we move on, so you're saying that you think Jimmy's better than Tatum? Is that what you think right now at this point in time? The guy who finished fourth in the MVP vote is not as good as Jimmy Butler. Just wondering. I'm trying to get you on the record. Yes, I'm gonna give me, give me, give me Butler over Tatum. Okay. When Jimmy Butler hit the, hit the time out on Al Horford, I know you were just dead on the inside. I know that that your life was flashing before. No, I was dead on the inside when Tatum sprained his ankle and was the only reason the Miami Heat won that basketball game. Yeah, that was what I mean. When one of your first two home games then, just win one of those, just win one of those. How about that? That's cool. Oh, that's fine. Hey, hey. When the Celtics won Game 6 on one of the luckiest shots in NBA history, like they should be thankful that there is even a Game 7 for Tatum to sprained his ankle in. How many hours of sleep have you lost thinking about when Yokech fell, like was sitting on the bench and foul trouble, and like the fully formed Miami Heat at home, biggest quarter of the season just couldn't get it done and we're just cooked by Aaron Gordon and Bruce Brown and Contavia's Caldwell Pope. I just, I'm just wondering how many hours of sleep you've lost this summer thinking about that situation. Zero? Because the nuggets were my finals pick. And I did a story on every one of those players that you mentioned in the last year. Okay. So thrilled. Yeah. Thrilled for my personal agenda. So your number four is Jimmy and Bam. Okay. What's up, everybody? This is Suncane. And Emilia Hartford. And this is our new podcast, Car Stories. We get to bring you guys into our world and our community where maybe otherwise you would never get to meet these incredible people. Including friends like Peter Brown, who did all the sound design for the Fast and Furious movies. And it's our fantastic opportunity to be an extension of the characters in the film. The more weird character that I can get into a car, the better. And then we also get to talk to Matt Farah, the Wikipedia of cars. This truck was wild. It was really a two-seater, but it had eight cup holders for two people. We also have John Oates, Jordana Brewster, Jesse E. Wuji, Rod Amory, and so many more. Listen to Car Stories with Suncane. And Emilia Hartford. Thanks September 21st on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Because even if you're not a gearhead, everyone has a car story. What's good, y'all? 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The best way to crush your opponents this season is to listen to the NFL Fantasy Football Podcast. Come hang out with me, Marcus Grant, and my pal, Michael F. Florio, as we give you all the info you need to absolutely steamroll your fantasy league and bring home a championship. You don't need to spend hours each day breaking down every stat and every stitch of game tape to set a winning lineup. That's our job. We'll provide all the insights you need to set the best lineups each week. All you need to do is listen to the NFL Fantasy Football Podcast when it drops five times a week. If you're looking for a smart, fun, and entertaining path to dominating your fantasy leagues, then look no further than the show straight from the source at NFL Media. Do it before it's too late. Subscribe now and listen to the NFL Fantasy Football Podcast on the iHeartRadio app on Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. All right. My number... You want to give your number three? You want me to go? I'll do it. I think I'm going to switch my number three and two now that I think about it, so give me your number three. Oh jeez. My number three is Kevin Durant and Devon Booker. Same. Your number three is Kevin Durant and Devon Booker. Flipping it to any other way would have been too spicy for me personally. I mean, you know, haven't really played a lot together. They're net rating in the playoffs. Do you want to guess what it was in 416 minutes together? I have no clue what was it. Minus zero points. Wow. Yeah. It is unfortunate that they ran into the nuggets. Also I keep seeing this and I've seen you, one of these people, peddle this take, the wills or the team that challenge the nuggets to most. It's true. Do the sons get no credit for winning two games? It's fat. I don't care. Do the sons get no credit for winning the most games against Daniel? You got to watch the games though. Watch the games, which game... Okay, but... Okay, but... I can't... Wait, wait, wait. Let me just say this. Jaden McDaniels did not play in that series. Yes, yes. Jaden McDaniels? They had no one. They had Nikhil Alexander Walker guarding Jamal Murray, getting destroyed in Crenshaw. All those games were very competitive or most of them in the fourth quarter, one of them going into overtime. So the Minnesota Timberwolves were... Yes, yes. But I'm not saying that's a wrong take. I'm just saying people really gloss over the fact that the sons took two games off of them and also Devon Booker was in it. Oh, he cut. Same. That was another planet. I believe we'll play off series I've seen from someone. No, let me tell you the worst take out of the playoffs of all time, or from last year's playoffs, is that the Los Angeles Lakers were competitive in a four game sweep. That's the worst take. Oh, boy. Everyone has. So I just want to put that on record before we move on. There was a no point in those four games where I was like, the Lakers got this one. No, absolutely not. So yeah, I have Katie book, you know, not overthinking it, Booker is the best to guard in the NBA. Who do you have right now in Booker versus Tatum? Booker versus Tatum? Yeah. I personally like Tatum. I think he brings more to the game in terms of rebounding and defense than Devon Booker does. Just Jason Tatum have a son. They never mentioned this on the broadcast. Do you know if he has a kid? The amount that you text and talk to me about young deuces, honestly, it does, it pales in comparison to the amount that he's mentioned on that's not a cute child. He's a cute child. But you want me to say first NBA player to ever have a child apparently. All right. He's just a great father. I think our top two are going to be the same here. I hope so. Number two, I have Stefan Dremond. Yes. Okay. Thank God. Who do you think you were talking to? I know. You could have been like, Kauai and Norm Powell because they, um, Stefan Dremond, man, I, I'm so glad Dremond resigned. I love that Mike Dunleavy took over and was like, enough of this two timeline stuff. I'm trading for Chris Paul. I'm resigning Dremond. Like, let's go get it. Um, I think that they, they sound, they're saying all the things that make me feel like they're going to have a big season. And I think that we're, if they stay healthy, I think we're going to get some like equilibrium back in the Western conference, which was kind of wonky last year. Like the Clippers warriors and Lakers all had just a lot of upheaval injuries, et cetera. Like, I think we're going to, we're going to be in for a great top half of the West race this year. And I'm, I might be ready to bet warriors for a championship championship. Championship. Wow. Yeah. I really, I really want to see the warriors and nuggets playing off series of boat teams at full strength. Uh, I, yeah, that would be amazing. Um, I, yeah, I mean, I have these two here because it's really, you know, it's really interesting before we, I just, first of all, it should be obvious that the, like, we shouldn't even need to explain why these two are where they are in this list. But I will say, if you were to go, I'm doing this half the top on my head right now as I just look at my list. And if I were to take all 20 players that we have, where would Dremon be individually on this list? Do you think in the bottom five, right? Like I think he's better than subonus. Oh, I don't even have subonus. So for me, it's like, Drew, yeah, uh, Harden, um, I guess, I, I don't know. I think James Jackson Jr. is better. Honestly, it's just, it's just the alchemy of the two of them together is, oh, you can't argue with him. Incredible. And I, the point I like have been trying to make with some people over the years is at the end of the day, the offense is more important. But what Steph does for their offense is what Dremon does for their defense. Uh-huh. Is he makes it, he makes it go. But it's, I still think he's probably, I still think the last guy who's had success guarding YoKitchen a playoff series. Well, if you, you know, success is to be defined in one's own way, but, uh, yes, I don't think anyone's ever had success guarding YoKitchen a playoff series, but he did a really good job. I will say, for sure, um, I think YoKitchen average, like a, like, 30, 12 and nine or something crazy in that series, but, um, with Montenores is his second best teammate, but, um, yes. But yeah, like, uh, no, I mean, Dremon is, uh, transcendent player on that end, total short circuiter of offensive game plans and, um, I mean, the reason, like that all goes without saying the reason that I have them here is just like their pick and roll is, yeah, is it? That's it. No, there's no, there's no guarding it, like watching the, I guess like watching them, watching the Lakers try to deal with it was really fascinating and I thought the, you know, the Lakers did like a really good job for throughout stretches of that series. I don't think that they ever like were super confident in how they were guarding it. And I think like, you know, obviously they had to flip things around, they used Gary Peyton, the second is the screener and they have to, you know, make their adjustments, but like that series was really competitive in a lot of ways and it was like one Lonnie Walker, Walker, fourth quarter, yeah, that's like the difference. So like, yeah, I don't think they solved anything. I think they're still super dangerous, the warriors are and if you look at their bench real like not, I don't have to make this a warriors pod, but like, no, I wanted to ask you about it. I was like looking over, um, just, you know, rosters and stuff to get reacquainted with the NBA and, oh my, I forgot they have Dario Sarge, I was like, oh my god, this, this like, uh, they can play a 10 man rotation with an all bench mob that's like really, uh, Chris Paul, Danny Peyton, Sarge, Sarge, and then you have Moody and Kuminda, right? So just like not a lot of shooting there and not a lot of size, but like really, that's a really interesting group that I think can play and like a lot of damage. Being able to just run Chris Paul picking roles as a bench thing for them this year is gonna be huge. I know this is whole, Chris Paul apparently still is not really bought into or I shouldn't say bought into, but he's coming off the bench. He's coming off the bench. He's coming off the bench. He has to like, just look at the, the quintet of loony, wiggins, green, clay, staff, like, sorry, that's the starting five, like, we're starting five last year too. They just didn't play the other time. Um, yeah, that, I'm very fascinated to see Paul with them and see how many games he closes and how they're closing lineups, et cetera. But man, I'm so glad we have Stefan Dreymon for at least another three years. It seems like, um, do you, are you then, well, let's talk about our number one duo, which is obviously Yo-Kitchen Murray, um, Derek White and Rob Williams, yeah, yeah. The best trade package for Damien Lillard, um, uh, dear, are the nuggets still the title favorites for you? Hmm, it's a great question. I would, I would slot them in as the favorite, but I would say that they are eminently beatable. Last year, I didn't feel that they were beatable, like, I just thought that they were clearly the best. Yes. Like, when they're healthy, they're the best, um, but, you know, Bruce Brown, really important player. And I know on both ends of the four, yeah, a lot of talk about, you know, how they'll slide. Maybe either Christian, Christian Brown or, uh, you know, they've re-signed Reggie Jackson to this. That was crazy. That was nuts. Um, and they have a lot of other, uh, young guys. As a guy, people think can be pretty good, but he's not, he's not a Jeff Green replacement. Jeff Green was also hit a huge shots for them in that playoffs, right? Playoff, right? He was big. He was really versatile. I just think like, at the end of the day, fundamentally why we have this duo as number one is because it almost doesn't matter what is around them. When they're both on the court, they are a wrecking ball. And they can beat you in so many different ways, like randomly, it's impossible to defend them. Mm-hmm. They know each other better than any two teammates in the NBA besides Stefan Dremon. They work better, arguably better, offensively than those two. And like, you don't even need great spacing. You don't need, like, there's so much stuff you don't need because of how brilliant Yoke it is. And all the ways he can kill you and then, like, Murray's shot creation in the playoffs was just like, he won them game three finals. He won them game three of the finals. Um, I've been every NBA player I've spoken to this summer, I'm working on a couple stories for a preview issue. At the end of every interview, I've said, can I ask you a question or sure, how would you stop Yoke itch? What's the way to stop Yoke itch? No one's had an answer. No one people have talked to us in an answer, I'm like, still figuring out, gotta find a way. He's just that good. Like, you know, like, some guys just said good, some teams are just that good. They, I don't know how you're going to do it. Like, it's going to have to be degradation of the supporting cast. And that's where they are. I mean, who's there back up center? Is it going to be Zeknoji? This is the, I mean, in the playoffs, it's Aaron Gordon. Yeah. So this is the next five on their depth chart right now. Is Reggie Jackson, Christian Brown, Brown, Justin Holiday, Peyton Watson, Zeknoji? I don't know, man. Well, what I will say about them is, but the reason that they are still, you can argue title favorites is because of how good Yokeachin Murray are. Absolutely. And I don't think they're chomping at the bit to break up the core pieces that helped them win a title, but, you know, people, you know, it's, it's, it's September, right? Like, at the trade deadline, we'll see what happens if they knew to make them move. You're saying MPJ's out of there. I'm not saying that, but I'm saying, you know, you're saying, you don't know. MPG, get ready to learn Chinese, buddy. That's what you're, I'm kidding, I'm kidding, I'm kidding. No, you don't, you just don't know this far out, but, yeah, the way that these two and in particular, Yokeach elevates everyone around them, like they're just, they're super special. And it is like, I just think that the gap, the gap is not, they're going to go 16 and more on the playoffs again, because the sons are, the sons are like really good. Like, what do you make of the sons? I think they're really good. I think you have these two absolute transcendent offensive talents, just get buckets against any coverage you want. And then you add Brad Biel to that equation. And I, that should be one of the best offenses in the history of the NBA. I don't know, there's no point guard, but like, you've got veteran savvy, you've got guys who should be looking to sacrifice. You have Aiton who will see what happens there. Eric Gordon is the fifth guy in closing playoff lineups, like really love that. I generally like, I generally like their, the supporting, like isn't bowl bowl in Phoenix. Yeah, yeah. Just like, just wild talent upgrade versus what was there last year when they lost in six to the nuggets. I just think that they've improved dramatically. You have a season of failure together, which will tighten well, you have a couple weeks of failure together. I don't know that you have a sure, but the season, you have a few games, right? But it was better than one of the reasons why I thought everyone who picked the sons was like, what do you, what are you guys talking about? It was because it's like, you don't just come into the playoffs and went for playoff series. Like, that doesn't, that's not how it works. So, I think their failure will spur them. We'll see what Frank Vogel can do to the defense. Can he get through to Aiton? That'll be really fascinating subplot. I like them a lot. Can I give you my hot take? Please. I, I'm not talking about winning the title, so don't get me wrong, but team that can finish top four in the regular season, and then we'll see what happens. Minnesota Timberwolves. Okay, I thought you were about to say the sons, and I was like, this is the worst hot take ever. No. You're high on the wolves? Why? I think the Timberwolves are like, they could be so, so good. Like, so good. I, I, you have the ant leap, right? The ant, the ant who just got knocked out of Fiba by Dennis Shudder and Danny Paz. That's because I, it's because Austin Reeves can't guard anybody. That's because Austin Reeves can't guard anybody. No, ant is going to be, I mean, he'll contend for the all in, in all NBA team this year. He's that good. You have a dimension. They just have, they just have the most unserious front court, maybe ever. No, it's a, unlikable, fine. Sure. Unserious? Yes. I, so can we, can we, maybe we can use this to jump into the honorable mentions conversation about things that, okay, okay. So I had, I actually had ant and cat as my number 10 for a while and I swapped them out kind of at the last second because like, when you talk about complimentary people, like stars and talents, like that pick and roll right there just has so much, but it's like oozes potential and we didn't really get to see it last season. But did you not feel like they kind of made more sense last year when cat wasn't in the lineup? No, I don't, no, I don't think that, at least. I feel like that was when Edward started playing better. By necessity perhaps, but what's better for Edwards is not necessarily better for the basketball team as we just saw with Team USA when he's taken, just playing home run Derby in his basketball. No, I think that they're, like, I love their support and cast, love so many of those pieces, love their depth. I just think that they were hurt last year. I thought the Angela Russell was just a terrible piece there. Like a really good starting five. If you look at the lineup data with the for some of aunt, cat, go bear and JD McDaniels when those four played, like their defensive rating was amazing last season and they actually played more minutes than I think you'd suspect. And I love Chris Venge. I think he's one of the best coaches period in the league and they were really just marred by injuries and dysfunction last year in a lot of ways that were hard to overcome. I don't necessarily think that it was more impressive for them to win a playoff game than the Denver Nuggets winning the NBA title, as Cat has said on a podcast forum. But very serious thing to say. But I do. I do. I do think that just like a lot of people thought last year was the year that they would be like, oh, there would be going to be amazing on the defense in the regular season. I feel like that's this year. I think they're going to be a really good regular season team. And so that's why I'll give you credit for this because two years ago, you were kind of like, I think the wolves can be really good. And you were early on the McDaniel's hype, um, which is amazing. Yeah. So I just, I just look at him as like, I don't think they're going to be better than the suns. I don't think they're going to be in the clippers. I don't think they're going to be better than the warriors. I don't think they're going to be better than the Nuggets. And I don't think they'll be better than the Lakers. Maybe Lakers now stop you, I, you are just the program. So blinded by disgust and hatred for the Lakers, um, that, I mean, you, you, you have LeBron and AD is one of your top 10 duos and yet, I say, I say that to throw everybody off the cent. That's what I do. That's my strategy. Um, can I just run through my honorable minutes? Yes, please, please, please. Okay. So I had, uh, Ant and Cat. This is no particular order. Uh-huh. And Fox and subonus, uh, Demargeros and Zach Levine, some of the mentions, these are honorable mentions, dog. Like, what do you want from me? Well, now you're, that's, you're just listing duos if you throw them in there. I have, I have nine, I have nine. I have nine. Get out of here. You're just picking a duo from every team at this point. Two multiple time all stars. Like, what do you want from me? Okay, whatever. That one's, you'll love the next two, then, um, Trey Young and Dejante Murray on the series. Franz Wagner and Paolo Boncaro. That one's a good one. That one's a good one. Okay. That's a good one. They can. They can. I would take Franz and Paolo next year over Trey and Dejante. I mean, that's fair. Sure. Yeah. Paolo is a mate like Julie. Yeah. I mean, they were, they're both just, yeah, they're great. Um, so I have Donovan Mitchell and Evan Mobley was my, uh, Jalen Brunson and Julius Randall. Come on. Jalen Brunson and Blight. Okay. So I'm saving my best for last. Jalen Brunson and Josh Hart. I'm saving my best for last. The one that the people who are still listening are probably screaming at us to, to say, um, the next one, second to last, Brad and Angerum and Zion Williamson. Okay. I was going to ask specifically, what did you think about the Pelicans for this exercise? Because last year when I did the Andrew Sharp, he put them number one, which was actually very inspired. And I respected, um, over under 50 games, 50 more games for Zion Williamson and Pelicans uniform. Like, what do you mean this season? In for the rest of his career, well, Zion Williamson played over under 50 games so the New Orleans Pelicans. Over. Okay. You know, you're now, you're unfazed by the Zion trade height this summer? I think people forget how good he is. If I was a GM and I traded Zion, they were in the one seed last year when they were healthy when he was healthy. The whole team. He's entirely unstoppable. Like, just stopped. Agreed. Yeah. He's, yeah. I just can't get a read on the dynamics there. I really can. He's too, everyone thinks he honest is. No, I'm absolutely kidding. Please. To Shelby, don't break that one out. Um, okay. So this is the last honorable mention I have and this is the one where I think like, I honestly think there were, there were no disrespect to the listeners, but, um, I think that there were listeners who, when we were like, oh, you know, exhaling about who we had number one, that this is the duo that a lot of people thought we were going to say, um, Luca Doncic and Kyrie Irving. Oh, get out of here. Oh, my God. I didn't even consider them for a second for what? I mean, uh, there's a lot of crazies out there, my friend. I looked this up. I, I have it here, but their net rating together was like so unspectacular. And listen, that, that roster needed, they missed the play in, they missed the play in and like, what did they do this summer to upgrade? I mean, I do, I do love Grant Williams, maybe I think that's actually like an inspired move, but, um, they had a 4.5 net rating with Luca and Kyrie together, which is solid, but it's not like, that's actually better than Baman, Jimmy, unbeatable duo, but it's better than Baman, Jimmy. Just go through it out there. Um, I just, I'm not, I mean, listen, the one team missed the play and the other one made the final. So I'm not, I'm not sweating it. Yeah, that I, the fact that they've hitched Luca to Kyrie is like, if I pitched, if I pitched that to Cuban in the Shark Tank, he'd be like, I'm like, um, I'm like, Mark, for $40 million a year, I'm asking you to pair this point guard who was suspended for an anti-Semitic controversy and has blown up, uh, every team he's ever played for, um, can I get you to sign off on that? Like he's out immediately, you know what I mean? You know, maybe Mr. Wonderful offers me some kind of debt loan situation on that offer, but Cubans out, Cubans out if I pitched that to him in the tank. Uh, it's, it's tough, um, it's tough and at the same time, I'm not saying I'm talking myself into this duo because I'm definitely not. I'll never talk myself into this duo. I am talking myself into lean cut Luca, like just, just destroying the NBA this season. I'll talk to myself into that, um, and it felt honestly like he's so good that I wanted to put him on the list. It was like, with y'all, I think two years ago, we maybe did that. He's just so good. Yes. He's so good. But where do they watch Slovenia? Like what the fact that Slovenia is like hanging with him, then when they lose, people are like, Shay's better. I'm like, okay. Yeah. That makes sense. Sure. Sure. He's, he's, he's no Goren droggage when it comes to international hoops, but, uh, where do you know? No, I saw that actually Goren droggage might be a point guard option for the Miami heat this season. I'm not even kidding. That was the actual thing that was published in a newspaper. He's going to be the new you guys in the newspaper. Okay. It was in a newspaper. It was in the local Miami newspapers. Where do you have the maps finishing in the West? Uh, it's a good question. Um, haven't thought about it. I, you know, I, I would think that they make the plan at least. I would think I would hope, um, I'm pro rockets right now. I'm not going to lie to you. I think the trick by the rock, it's, let's go. I don't know if they did get Brooke Lopez too. I'm so Dylan Brooks pilled. Like if, if Brooke Lopez was on the team, I would, I would, like, seriously, have Dylan Brooks in, yeah, home court in the first round. Um, I'm, I'm, I'm just, I just, I love Shingoon, like more than, he's one of my favorite players in the whole. Oh my God. So this is why I have to sound like I'm a Shingoon hater because the hype is out of control, but he is very good. I, I, defensively, it's going to be interesting now that there's a little bit of expectation on them to win. Um, no, let me stop right there. There is no expectation. Let me put it this way. Teams are going to take them a little bit more seriously now that they have been Leighton Brooks. Um, okay. And I'm interested to see how guys like Jalen Green, Jabari Smith and Shingoon respond to that, but they're starting five on paper. Those five guys kind of sit kind of fun. Awesome. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like a summer league style, yeah. It could be fun. Yeah. Trade Jalen Green. See what you can get. Mm-hmm. Okay. Well I'm not getting back into all of that. I don't want you to get in trouble. I don't want you to issue any public apologies here. Um, you know, let Jalen Green cook on that note Mike. I appreciate you joining, even though once again your list left a lot to be desired. Um, I'm the father of this exercise. I cannot be wrong. And it's like, at least you're the Oppenheimer meme. Um, uh, Mike, everyone can continue to read your work over at the ringer. You're doing a great job. I'm excited to read your, uh, breakdown of this USA Germany game over there. You know, I'm very excited about it for sure. Hell yeah, I'm looking forward to hopefully doing this podcast again when we get heat Celtics for, uh, in the classes here, buddy. What's happening with Dame? What's the prediction? Um, it's going to happen. It's going to happen. Just what's the, what's the package? I need to see Shelby's reaction. Well, they obviously can't trade you over to now. So it's going to have to be hero, Lowry, uh, two first round fix. Sorry, Cronin. That's just, that's the way the chocolate crumbles sometime, you know? What's your take on the new Olivia Rodrigo album? I have not listened to a new album in, uh, two years, three years. Are we still recording? What's going on? Yeah. What's up, everybody? This is Suncane and Amelia Hartford. And this is our new podcast, Car Stories. We get to bring you guys into our world where maybe otherwise you would never get to meet these incredible people. We'll talk to people from all over the car community, including friends like Peter Brown, Jon Oats, Matt Ferra, and so many more. Listen to Car Stories with Suncane and Amelia Hartford starting September 21st on the iHeartRadio app Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

Top Ten 2023 Duo's w/ Michael Pina