AEW President Tony Khan | Pollock & Thurston

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He will be locating Brandon Thurston, who is just pulled away temporarily, however. The format of this show, we spoke with Tony Khan and he is going to be our big guest this week. We spoke with him for context on Monday afternoon. We are going to run the interview and afterward, we will react to the interview, the key points that were brought up by Tony Khan throughout the interview, and then take a look at some of the other news stories. If you do want to get in a super chat, you are welcome to do so. David and I will answer those super chats afterwards, whether you want to speak about the interview, other subjects, the forum is yours once we wrap up the interview with Tony Khan. So without further ado, we are not going to waste any time. We will speak with you on the back end and Brandon Thurston will be here with me when the interview concludes. But here it is myself and Brandon Thurston in conversation with AEW President Tony Khan. It is a huge month for AEW among the highlights coming up in June, the release of AEW Fight Forever, the forbidden door pay-per-view here in Toronto on Sunday, June 25th. But this week, all roads leading to the debut of AEW Collision on TNT at 80s from the United Center in Chicago. It is a pleasure to be joined here on Paulic and Thurston for the first time by AEW President Tony Khan and Tony, thank you so much for taking some time to sit down with us. It is always a busy time, but this month in particular, it seems like a lot of crossroads of a lot of big projects all coming to a head. It is a really exciting month for AEW and in fact, it is a really exciting week for AEW. We have a lot happening this week. As you said, John, with AEW Wednesday night Dynamite in Washington, D.C., the site of our very first AEW Dynamite ever, Wednesday night will be at the capital one arena in Washington, D.C., and not only was it the site of the first Dynamite ever, but I think the card we have for this week really stands up and is one of our best Dynamite cards. It is going to be a great show, I really believe, this Wednesday night, tonight in fact. We have Dynamite tonight and also a big Saturday night collision premiere coming. As you mentioned, AEW fight forever coming out this month. I think we have got AEW and New Japan partnering on what I expect to be one of the best events. Either company has ever participated in for Bid & Door coming up June 25th there in Toronto. I have to say, I am excited to talk to both of you together. I have talked to Pollock, I have talked to Thurston, but I have never talked to Pollock in Thurston as a team, so this is very exciting for me personally. We thank you for participating here in the handicap match with both of us at the same time. I just want to go back a week and certainly I am sure there are Wednesdays where you must be very optimistic. There are other Wednesdays where the competition is very intense, such as last week was between the NBA Finals, Vanderpump Rules is on fire. You guys doing a .33, you had a week to digest that number. What do you think attributed to you holding up so well as you did last week against? I thought one of your tougher Wednesdays. I really thought the competition was very tough, but I believe we had a great show and I was really pleased that it held up and did such a strong number. I think we planned for a great match to start with the International Championship match or Orange Cassidy versus Swerve Strickland. I think I really believe going in that people would be very excited about MJF and Adam Cole coming face to face and I wanted to put some time into that segment. Also had a great main event. Ricky starts Jay White that people would look forward to and a strong card. I think there was some anticipation about what the main event on collision was going to be. Certainly Jungle Boy and Hook as a team did well in that spot and up and down on the show. I thought there was a really, really strong card and I had the BCC and the best friends out there with Rocky Romero being involved. You had Chaos and the BCC out there, a little preview of Ocata versus Brian Danielson with Brian Danielson on commentary. The way we did it with a video on Brian and Ocata at a segway into the match, I really thought it was a strong presentation and I'm glad it delivered such a positive rating. I was really glad to see that at 0.33, a really strong number against a really strong competition, so that bodes really well for AEW. Before our in the middle for the MJF and Adam Cole's second, I noticed. Yeah, it was really strong there and it was a strong open too. I think we started really well and then had a really good number in the crossover spot as we went into the 9 o'clock hour and it continued and then had a nice match after that with hook and jungle boy versus the LFI and the tornado tag held up pretty well. So absolutely, like you said, very positive indication to see the World Champion MJF and Adam Cole doing such a strong number being out there together. That bodes really well going into tonight's show with Adam Cole versus MJF in an eliminator match for a shot at the AEW World Championship. On Monday, there's a new report from New York Post about DotaE's negotiating windows. But they mentioned here that Warner Brothers Discovery does not have to stay exclusive to AEW. I was wondering if you could speak to whether that's true. Well, I don't want to talk too much about the contract we have with Warner Brothers Discovery, but I definitely have some pretty favorable things in there and given the commitment that Warner Brothers Discovery is making for AEW with collision and dynamite, I think it really shows that they're fully committed to AEW. We just had AEW all access also launch on max in addition to being on TBS every Wednesday night like tonight and on TNT every Friday and now every Saturday night starting this week with the launch of collision. Is David Zazloff turning out to be a big wrestling fan? I think so. I think so. I really believe David Zazloff has been a very, very strong supporter of AEW. I believe when he came in and said, I want two more hours of AEW on Saturday nights, that was one of the biggest votes of confidence that you could give us and it was certainly very favorable for us to hear that he wanted that and then to be able to deliver it in very quick turnaround and put together what I think is going to be a great, great show with AEW collision every Saturday night. There's been a lot of management change over the years, especially as a concern as the merger. Who are the executives with WBD now that you're working with most often? I mean, David Zazloff is the CEO. We've heard the name Kathleen Finch, are there other people you're working across? Those are people we work really closely with. Also, in addition to Mr. Zazloff and Kathleen Finch, you've been great supporters of AEW. Jason Sarlanis has been an amazing friend to AEW and he runs TVS and TNT and since he's come in, has been a huge supporter of AEW and he's also been very closely involved in the decision to give us two more hours and we've worked with Jason to develop collision. Jason has great experience in wrestling. He actually had worked at AE with Total Divas, so had experience with Total Divas and I believe a lot of wrestlers who've been through AEW female in-mail had participated in that show in one way or another and certainly he was very familiar with a lot of the big pro wrestlers including some of the top pro wrestlers in AEW. Did that play into how all access came to be? I think all access we were working on for a while and the idea for all access was something we had put forward then Jason coming in was a great supporter of all access and also very insightful about all access and I was really pleased how it did and really we did a very good number for the finale I thought and hopefully Bozwell for the future of the show. Now I'm glad as I was saying a few moments ago I'm glad it's available for people on HBO Max or excuse me on Max on Max now. What would you say has changed in the sense that you were adding two hours of ring of honor programming that is now on honor club and with the addition of collision. Was ring of honor ever in the discussions to fill this new Saturday night time slot? Not for TNT I think the idea of two more hours of AW was very appealing. What it meant was that AEW dark and AEW dark elevation would be come into an end at least for now and they were great shows and they've been huge for the development of AEW and so many great wrestlers from a developmental perspective got their start in AEW on darker elevation and it includes a lot of people who've been champions and are a major part of the show now on a weekly basis. I think in the future ring of honor is going to be really important to the development of AEW and thankfully we were able to devote thousands of matches across hundreds of episodes of dark and elevation to really fostering a young roster building people up and now I think we have a great outlet also in a sister company and ring of honor and also our partnership with New Japan pro wrestling and other great partnerships other companies we work with to create possibly excursions or other great experiences for our wrestlers to get experience overseas or domestically. With the addition of collision and obviously that's going to be on Saturday night. Battle of the Belts has been on Saturday night, it's been on Friday after rampage is Battle of the Belts going to continue even though it is okay. Battle of the Belts will continue which is great and as for where the next battle of the Belts episode will run on TNT whether it'll be a Friday or Saturday it's a great question and still talking about that and we'll have a good answer for you on that soon. On the philosophical front Tony I think most most audience members would believe that dynamite is a winning formula the numbers have backed that up. Are you approaching collision as the idea of going from two hours and adding an additional two hours of this winning formula or do you believe that there needs to be some distinctions between what people are consuming on Wednesday nights and what you're getting on Saturday nights from a variety of different fronts? Well I think you hit the nail in the head they're great John I believe the last thing you said is really accurate. I want to take some of the great things we developed that are part of the working formula but I also want to create a distinct show with a distinct identity and I really believe we can do that with collision and present great wrestling show every Saturday night 8 p.m. Eastern starting this week 7 p.m. Central there in Chicago and we're going to have a great crowd for this first episode they're going to be red hot I know and it's going to be a great show. I think there are some advantages to running the show on Saturdays and I'm looking forward getting off to a great start and building off it. It's going to feature the return of CM Punk teaming with FTR against Samoa Joe juice Robinson and Jay White obviously I know you're not going to get into the weeds on this but we're there periods over these last 9-10 months that you would have thought it would be pretty surreal days out that we would be talking about the ability to have CM Punk in an AW ring in a wrestling capacity once again or were you the eternal optimist during all of these months? Well, I'm very excited for the match this Saturday I'm very excited for CM Punk's return to the ring and I think it's a great trio's match. You have CM Punk teaming with the AEW World Tag Team Champions FTR one of the greatest trio's in wrestling when they get together I believe and going up against a new trio that is very exciting to have Jay White and juice Robinson coming off one of the biggest wins we've seen for Jay White since he arrived in AEW. I think probably the biggest win he's at in AEW and this is somebody who's had great wins all over the world and built a great reputation and with Jay White and juice Robinson now they've become a really hot unit as a bullet club gold and to have them teaming up with Samoa Joe who is a top name in the world of pro wrestling and brings so much to the table and to have Samoa Joe who's a huge star out there against one of his greatest rivals CM Punk and I think that works both ways I believe Samoa Joe is also one of CM Punk's greatest rivals. I think it's just a great great opening match to have opening main event rather to have a great main event like this to launch a great show. I think if we open up with a strong show we have a chance to get off to a strong start for collision and I think for a variety of reasons I'm very excited we're able to offer this match and able to put it on TV on Saturday night on TNT. I think the timing of CM Punk recovering from the tricep injury and the launch of the show is very, very good. When they came to us and we started talking about the dates I realized this would line up with about the time he would be hopefully ready to come back and return to the ring and he's been working really hard to get back in the ring and obviously there are things that have happened outside the ring that you might want me to talk about that I cannot talk about but I would love to talk about the wrestling show and I'm very excited to have this match on TNT on Saturday night. Yeah and I respect that you cannot get into all the specifics but we are going into there is such a giant elephant in the room regarding all out and does that help or does that hurt if we're not going to go in that direction because I think your audience is tuning in Saturday night and that is going to be a big reason why is to hear from this individual. Well it's a great point I think people are going to want to hear from CM Punk and people are going to want to see him get involved in big matches and jump in this big stories and I think definitely the rivalry between CM Punk and Samoa Joe very interesting we've seen a budding rivalry with FTR against a number of top teams in AW but I think with them having retained the championship at double or nothing and with Jay White coming off such a huge win and Jay White and Zeus Robinson as a team being Red Hot we saw they had a run in with FTR a few weeks ago at the paper view at double or nothing after FTR retained the championship and I felt like that also planted another seed for this match certainly though people are always going to go back to that rivalry between CM Punk and Samoa Joe people have been talking about it even before Samoa Joe arrived in AEW and not long after that CM Punk got injured and at double or nothing you know Samoa Joe hadn't really been here very long when CM Punk's foot was broken at that week and I do think this match is a huge main event and people are going to be very interested to see what happens. It's very very exciting for us to be able to put this match on the first episode of collision on Saturday which you know we were just talking about ratings and this past Wednesday was a very very good number for us I'm hopeful we can get another good number for tonight's episode of Wednesday night dynamite on TBS and you know build off that and hopefully keep some good momentum going into Saturday for collision. With the the debut on Saturday of collision it seems like there's a good opportunity to have that match maybe in the main event and another segment where CM Punk is talking on the microphone I'm sure people are really anticipating hearing from him. Can you say whether fans should expect to hear from Punk on the microphone on Saturday? I don't want to say too much yet I do think it would make a lot of sense though and I know fans are going to be excited to hear from CM Punk. Obviously that match is in the main event so that does leave us opportunities and the lead up to the show to do that and I think if you know I have to admit it would make a lot of sense. You've also announced that collision will be available up in our neck of the woods through the TSN plus screaming service. Can you talk a bit about just the role of Canada at this moment there are a lot of dates booked and some of your reactions as well like so obviously you have the the sellout of forbidden door gigantic demand for that some of the collision dates have been softer can you just assess like it's a lot of dates you're running in Canada how would you assess your health right now in Canada since it's going to be such a big part of the summer plans well I was really excited about the ratings as we talk about TV ratings you know last week was also a really strong week for us in Canada I don't know if you guys covered those ratings we mentioned the 0.33 we did in the U.S. in the 18 to 49 demo Dynamite edged out smackdown the previous Friday which was the 1000 day Roman Reigns celebration so it was it was a very good number for Dynamite in Canada last week. Yeah I understand we beat raw in the demo too yes yes you were I could pull them up here but it was 25 to 54 in Canada you get right 25 to 54 is the main demo that's measured here in Canada great well I know it was a really good rating for the show last week in Canada so I was excited about that and I think going into collision we're doing a number of shows for Dynamite and rampage and collision in Canada I think really with these collision events people don't know what to expect we've got really strong number for the show in Chicago that's going to turn out to be one of the biggest TVs we've done all year for the United Center collision debut Saturday night this weekend I think that bodes very well for the future I know the show in Newark for the first show back from Canada also was doing very well I'm excited to see what happens with our tour in Canada for both Dynamite and collision I think these Canadian fans collision of course as you mentioned we'll be streaming through TSN I'm excited about that I do think we have a great chance to promote these events coming up not just on Dynamite but also by having a great debut for collision to build a lot of buzz for the upcoming episodes I also think we can build some anticipation for the Owen Hart Cup matches which we'll be taking place and a lot of those will happen on collision also for some of those dates those have been announced a while ago like Calgary Regina Saskatoon I believe they were originally announced as house shows were they did you know when you booked them that they were going to become collision TV tapings not originally but then we had those Saturdays that when we were talking to TNT about doing a Saturday night show every week that would obviously fall in and be very great venues and great cities in Canada to convert those into TV shows this message comes from McCormick in company committed to enhancing people's health their communities and the planet McCormick healthy sustainable delicious to learn more tap the banner on your screen or visit McCormick Corporation dot com slash future of flavor when it comes to kind of a larger question that I'm very curious from your standpoint is certainly you have a lot of people around you that can provide instant feedback when it comes to outside of AW when you're looking for what is working and also being able to parse good faith criticism versus so much noise that is out there is that a near impossible task it like when you are trying to get the honest reactions from your fan base like it is I just feel you guys are under such a microscope and it's very hard to find good faith criticism out there are you still able to find that what you mentioned just like is always asking that's a great way to put it Brandon no absolutely John I think it's a great really really great point that these days you get a lot of feedback and not all that is necessarily constructive and I think really listening to the fans and trying to find that constructive feedback because there are a lot of great fans out there that have great ideas and I like to listen and you can't do every idea that every fan presents to you but I like to try to do different things that the fans are going to want to see a lot of times if there's a match with two people that are being really really well received it could be a baby face and a heel but they might have a heel that the fans are really getting behind and there might be a baby face the fans are really getting behind and I think the ratings do often give a good indication of that you know there's good feedback on social media but frankly the feedback on social media does not always correlate directly with Neilson rating performance good or bad and I think the Neilson rating performance is very important for us but also doing quality shows that the fans like including fans online who give feedback to us I think that really helps us too so it's a balance for sure but in a perfect world you do a show that everyone loves and does a great rating and we've done that at times and that's the best you go to the store and the uh sorry John you closely following the cage match ratings I look at the cage match ratings it's interesting they've changed the way that they do it now I think you have to wait a while to so add an embargo now it's a major change which probably I don't know if that's the better or worse but it's really interesting because there's probably people that have really strong feelings right after the show ends and they might not get around to going back and expressing those opinions so I think they changed the way they did it like you said there's an embargo uh so I do look at that but I spend more time looking at the Neilson ratings in the minute by minute in the quarter hours frankly one of the more interesting ones from me over the past couple of months I found it fascinating over this several day period was you announced Kenny Omega and Elhio del Vikingo as a dream match and suddenly this takes on a life of its own over several days about debating the merits of this being a dream match and the end result was this did a tremendous number and I'm just curious if you're just is the calculus so far ahead that we know something like this is going to engage such discussion or you just blown away by everybody about what they will pick apart such as a dream match scenario and here I think in a weird way it it built the match up that much more because of this several day online debate amongst audiences I have the ability to put a spotlight on something but in this case first of all Kenny Omega versus Elhio del Vikingo is a match that people really wanted to see it was a dream match in that sense that's why I said it it's true there were a lot of people that wanted to see it that's why I did a strong number on the merits of their wrestling and the strength of the match up and people wanted to see Kenny versus Vikingo and that's why they delivered I do think the talk helped and I believe it was good to put a spotlight on this because it was a kind of match people would want to see and I also expected it would garner a lot of conversation you sometimes things take on a life of their own and really when given the opportunity to book a great match like this and put a spotlight on it then you hope that the fans start talking about it and it takes on a life of its own and that one really did and it was great you mentioned in another interview that you view AW as a challenger brand it's a new brand and there's a big company WWE it's been around for decades who's the leader and what WWE does I would say creatively is so ubiquitous and so influential it has been over the decades and I met you want AW to be a strong alternative so is it something you think about like are we doing things sometimes that like in a way we don't even realize that there were being influenced by w and maybe there's another way that is just as effective or better than the way that they would do things because we've all grown up watching it you got a lot of wrestlers who used to be in wb I feel like it's where we're goldfish in the water sometimes and not realizing that there's a different way to do things is that something you think about it all yeah absolutely I think when we launched a w that was something that was really important to me their aspects of other wrestling promotions in the past that I thought really presented wrestling on TV very well and then there were things that hadn't been done in a long time and I think certainly were influenced by a lot of people I do view AW as a challenger brand that's actually an expression and a philosophy that was passed down to me from the management at Warner Brothers and it was the executives at TNT and TBS who gave me a big deck on what it means to be a challenger brand and there are other great examples of it you know Burger King is a great example I think Pepsi is a great example of a company to some extent that is a challenger brand in a major industry to an industry leader these are great companies and they're treated in the industry like major players like AW was treated as a major player in the wrestling industry but they're challenging a company that's been around for a long time an industry leader and you know if you look at Burger King's marketing a lot of it is like hey McDonald's sucks guys and like that's really what they've done and I think that's when people look at a challenger brand what they might not understand or have seen in learning about what it means to be a challenger brand is sometimes it means being very specific about your brand identity and in pro wrestling I do think for AEW the timing of when we launched the promotion was key the timing of rights fees for television in pro wrestling growing very quickly and and buy a big amount and also the talent knowing who a lot of the top pro wrestlers in the world are and worth the time and their availability and I think it's helped us carve out a really great place in the wrestling business and like to a new fan what would you say are some of the biggest differences that sets AWA apart from from WV or from other promotions I think AEW has the best roster of wrestlers in the world and if you want to watch pro wrestling it's a lot of its opinions but to me I believe that the best group of pro wrestlers in the world is the group in AEW and you have a great opportunity to see them and now I have can showcase them even more and showcase more people throughout dynamite rampage and now we've added collision and we've gone from three hours of TV now this week we'll have five hours of TV for the first time ever it's going to be so exciting and it's a great opportunity for the company and I think that's one of the things that sets us apart most importantly is the quality of the wrestlers and then the way we build to the matches I think there's really exciting matches ahead I believe there's an excitement about AEW that doesn't exist for any other wrestling promotion as far as the ability to go do events for the first time because we are a new company there's still places we've never been where we have a huge fan base a great example of this is the anticipation that built for AEW's debut in Europe and our first show in the UK and our first show in London and all of it has come together to create the perfect storm of excitement that has led to the biggest gate in the history of pro wrestling in Europe and one of the biggest gates in the history of professional wrestling and we're months away from the show and not a single match or participant has been officially announced or confirmed and I think there's a huge amount of excitement around AEW and we've grown this audience in a unique time a lot of our fans found AEW in the pandemic and there are people that started watching it all over the world or it became available to them in places all over the world for the first time we really grew our worldwide TV penetration now the show is available in over 150 countries around the world with AEW Dynamite and AEW collision work quickly getting up to those same kind of clearances I think for us the quality of our wrestling I believe stands above anyone but I also think there's a lot of great wrestling all over the world from multiple different promotions and that's what makes wrestling great there were some companies that are out there right now that were doing great wrestling and having some great matches before we launched but there was a space there was a clearly a place in pro wrestling specifically based in North America and an opportunity to launch the promotion that became AEW and it's gone incredibly well and we've done things beyond my wildest dreams and now the international expansion in particular the success of AEW all in London it's mind blowing in to be a part of an event that will now be in the record books is one of the biggest wrestling shows ever worldwide in the history of the planet that's pretty cool and how much of that card is already constructed in your head at this point like how far ahead are you getting yourself when it comes to plotting out you know such an important event in the company's history I have a lot of really great ideas for it and I like to see how things flow and if forbidden door goes as planned I think it will then lead us into what could be one of our all-time historic special moments for AEW all in I think we're going to have a great forbidden door and I'm very focused on that and if we get through that and if that goes as I expect then we are going to be in an amazing position for AEW all in and hopefully the brand interest will be incredibly high worldwide and it will focus itself into a very great event August 27 in London but I'm very focused on coming there to Toronto first and putting on a great one for you at forbidden door and building off that with the addition of collision I understand you know it's been reported that in January 2020 he signed a new deal with what was then Warner media my understanding is three years with a one-year option so that if if besides the option that would expire at the end of this year I have to think that WBD's not just signing up for collision for six months I've asked you about the option before you want to talk about it but maybe I can ask it this way should fans expect to see AEW on TNT and TBS in January I think there's I would expect that and I can't say much because of our contract with Warner Brothers Discovery but I definitely think we're planning into 2024 for that and hopefully for a very very like long time it's a great relationship and I'd like to be here for a very very very long time I'm very grateful that we're here and have been putting new content on TBS and TNT every single week since 2019 without a week off new shows every week for the wrestling fans all over the world some challenging times to through the lockdown and I believe we should be here for a long time I would really love it and I expect we hopefully would be here for that and the launch of collision is going to be great it's going to be a great event this Saturday I think to dine a night tonight will hopefully be great too it's a really strong lineup and there's a lot of excitement about the show and we're coming off a great rating for last week as we said and I think it's a great opportunity for tonight to build on it and then take that momentum to Saturday I would love to then carry that into forbidden door in a few weeks in Toronto and if that goes as I said before if that goes as well as I expect it will and we're going to be in a really strong position this summer well Tony we hope that you will extend the option to come back sometime and chat with Brandon and I that is maybe one option you can you can guarantee and we look forward to everything that's coming up of course dynamite tonight at eight eastern and then Saturday night the launch of collision eight eastern on TNT TSN plus in Canada and internationally certain regions can watch through AEW plus as well so Tony thank you very much for being generous with your time I know it's always a busy one for you and I hope we can do this again sometime this was really nice I really enjoyed visiting with both of you hopefully see you both soon maybe in the scrums and speaking of collision in addition to AEW collision John I'm going to attend the collision conference again that's this year so maybe I'll see you again there for the second year in a row up in Toronto too but I'm excited to spend a lot of time in Canada this summer and very excited to hopefully see both of you soon all right thank you very much Tony we appreciate the time thank you guys all right that was Tony con joining myself and Brandon Thurston who is here with us live hello Brandon and here you can hear me well you are coming in beautifully crystal clear so a lot covered there I thought in the 30 minutes was this your first time out listening back to it since we spoke with Tony on Monday well it was not my first time listening back is it yours no it wasn't the first time I listened back either so you and I have now probably gone through this multiple times at this point and gone over it I would say coming out of it I found I think that's as clear an indication that the option has been picked up or at the very least a formality that it is being picked up and that AEW programming will continue on Warner Brothers Discovery into the new year and that would take them to the end of 2024 which would be your understanding and I kind of guessed that that was the case anyway and his response to the question about the option makes me think even more so that the option has already been renewed I think he probably has a rule that he's not going to talk about anything related to the TV deal he talked more about things related to that later I guess but he was willing to you know I figured that was a good way to ask it because not answering it's in a response that is leaning towards the affirmative is you know it leaves the fans to think that maybe AEW is going to go away at the end of the year which is you know almost certainly not the case now we also got the the note that battled the belt would continue so you would expect probably four of those specials a year that would seem to make more sense on a Friday night than they would on a Saturday and we have seen sort of the pairing of battle of the belts with rampages which you would think that they that would seem to make the most sense three hours on a Saturday night sure you could you could do three hours on a Saturday night I know I think rampage is more likely yeah yeah I would think that that would be the the most likely scenario so as we are days out from collision what would you sense is the anticipation factor for this new show and where it's true and where it's launching because so much of it is surrounded around CM Punk and it remains to be seen how tonight is positioned in terms of your strong push towards Saturday and if any more announcements are made and what what is the buzz as we stand today going into Saturday's debut I mean it's it's not what rampage the second rampage or I suppose maybe even the first rampage was I would say a lot of that is because punk was about to debut for the first time and that's a much bigger deal than his return I think the the first collision is probably going to do something in the in the neighborhood of what Dine White does and it's going to be way down from there but it's I mean you can look at the attendances the attendance for the United Centers is something of an indication certainly not sold out Mike gets 10,000 so it's I feel I feel like a good chance of hitting 10 I feel that in that that last 24 hours they you would expect a market like Chicago and the punk like it will be interesting to see if if punk is if there's any public profile of punk going into like any kind of promotion beyond just what we have seen so far but I feel come like that 24 hour period it's it's a decent enough chance that they're at 8400 or so now that they move that those final you know 1400 1600 to get to 10,000 which is a respectable number it's not selling out the United Center but it it's hardly to me a disappointment it sounds like he'll do a promo punk well I don't know if they'll announce that tonight I don't know if it'll be new ice cream bars I doubt it amenities we told you catering for the entire United Cupcakes 10,000 cupcakes to go around yeah I mean I mean concept as much in there that you if you're tuning in to hear from punk I don't think you're going to be disappointed what I'm kind of curious about and we haven't talked too much about it is the fact that they are back in Chicago next Wednesday and how that show is handled in terms of if you are someone that bought tickets for a dynamite punk is not advertised for that show is there that expectation of having him involved in in some form or fashion on on Wednesday or if he is going to be exclusive on collision which they are outwardly advertising him now for Toronto the night before for Bindor yeah I don't know there's a there's a lot of unanswered questions and can he will he be in the same building as members of the elite as Kenny and may be young bucks and people like that there's a lot of unanswered questions and questions that I don't know if it's something if we had more time was I think to ask in other NDA he said doubt he would answer but it's worth worth approaching yeah unless he said I can't answer about NDA it's because I signed an NDA the follow up is is there an NDA that you can't talk about the NDAs there's two separate documents well as we get closer I I do wonder how much like certainly I think there's the idea that punk is back punk is able to do all these programs he's going to be working with certain people to me it is such a giant shadow the fallout of all out and everything with the elite and you're looking at collision and what could spark gigantic interest in this show and to me there's no bigger thing you could do than keeping this so quiet and it's the elite like laying out FTR and punk at the end of collision in Chicago and being berated now I just don't feel that the audience is necessarily expecting that but in pro wrestling that is the like could you imagine a scenario Brandon where Brett does not leave for WCW and him and Sean are just kept on like that there are ones on raw one week and ones on raw the other week and there's no interaction it's it's almost like this the audience is going to be left wanting for so long and maybe that is strategic that we know at some point there's going to be that payoff but I feel until you get there I just question how much of resistance is going to be from the audience when it's believed that the program everyone wants to see play out because of the real nature of it that you're deprived of that that it's just it's going to kind of take the air out of some of this of the sales of I mean I don't turn and based on not any special information I don't get the sense that the young bucks especially have any interest in working with punk so I don't have any expectation that that's going to happen maybe ever no and and it's there's also not the traditional incentive for performers in this case when you have guaranteed contracts and it's not as though okay well this is unless you're just you know putting company first and this would be great for the company but individually um why go through this if it's just you're not the ones necessarily that are making any more or any less based on your programs and and who you work with and all that is not going to necessarily be water under the bridge yeah but it is what the audience wants like that there's no question and you look at what would AEW need in terms of a big shot in the arm that is staring you in the face and it would seem that that I mean they are giving you every indication that that is not going to be something to expect and I think if you could summarize the sort of malaise of of AEW by that I mean you know the decline in TV ratings since September or so maybe even before that and some of the weakness in ticket sales we've seen recently at least one of the main themes to me has been that the most interesting stories the stories that we find ourselves talking about the most are not stories that are playing out or we have any reason to believe we're going to play out on television they're you know it's and you can go back to Cody leaving in January of 2022 and can't really talk about why he left that's a smaller one but then MJF supposedly maybe threatening to to no show the double or nothing pay review last year and then he went away for three months couldn't talk about that while it was going on a little bit a little bit bigger of a persona non-grata there and then in the following September we had all all all this fight controversy and we definitely can't talk about that and that's been the biggest one of all I think like if we were to talk to him again I would want to talk to him about the fact that he can't talk about so many things and does that come with any kind of cost do you think and what was his big talking point last summer before all out it was you know this stuff was playing itself out and in terms of you know Tony believing that it's it's not necessarily a bad thing that we know that some people don't get along with each other this is pro wrestling where that can be very valuable that was a big talking point for Tony Khan before all out but once you get so close to the sun in that case where it is disrupting your entire locker room and this situation like they are obviously in a position where Tony Khan doesn't it is not going to give you anything in terms of that discussion point but it is what your audience is so craving and I think by continually avoiding that topic it only heightens the desire for more information and I think that's going to extend to the expectation on your programming that is how fans are hardwired to expect conflict to be turned into a way for a company to profit and I think the unwillingness the decision not to talk about any of this stuff in any way whatsoever understand there's legal things involved here then I'm not even talking about the TV deal but I understand there's legal legal it's possible that there could have been or may even still someday maybe litigation surrounding this fight or something like that and I understand wanting to protect that or we're also stepping on a land mine days before this debut in the in the United States like you can understand it to a point but it seems like there is no negotiation about that of even addressing the bare bones of it as well so I can understand that people are frustrated by that but that is like the hardline stance that he has taken on that topic I think being this unwilling to talk about these subjects undermines AW's brand as a strong alternative an alternative to to wrestling companies in the US like WWE probably like TNA in its era that want to ignore the obvious ignore the thing ignore the elephant in the room that is that everyone is thinking about and no one is willing to talk about I think it undermines a lot of the the earnest trust that that AEW quickly earned since 2019 yeah I'm just curious to see how like we have not gone through any kind of period where the AEW audience has ever rooted against the company or you know you've gotten like crowds hijacking shows for instance there is that opportunity that I I am curious to see like the elite are they inundated with CM Punk chance over these next couple of months when he's on the other show and it's a diverse and vice versa I think it can go both ways that I'm just wondering is this going to be something where the show begins and people can just enjoy the program or is it is such a big story that that is what the audience is going to be craving and they are going to be screaming at the promotion and protest until they get what they want are we are we exaggerating this this issue or are we underplaying it I I feel like it is top of mind for a lot of fans and it represents the excitement behind CM Punk's return as opposed to the way you hear it as though well just CM Punk being back and working with Samoa Joe and juice Robinson and Jay White that is invigorating people I think it's the next extension of CM Punk's AEW run is exactly playing off of this real scenario you saw in what is a huge part of AEW's history is that press conference not necessarily a great memory in AEW's history but a significant one and the biggest news story in that company is the last year yeah and I think I don't believe it's the case that AEW fans like the overwhelming majority of AEW fans are following the wrestling news closely are listening to podcasts like this one where people are going through all the details and stuff like that but I think it's all the press conference I always think back to the Buffalo Dynamite that happened I lose the first dynamite right after all out right and I remember yeah right and I remember standing in the ticket line to get through you know to get through into the building and I remember hearing some fans you know talking and it's only days since this happened and there were like fans like what we're trying to explain to each other what was going on so there were some fans at least you know three days later or whatever it was that weren't aware of it I do think that even if yes that there's there's a lot of fans who aren't paying attention to this stuff really but I think this stuff does the the the brand perception and this sort of chatter does trickle down one way or another to it to be a significant effect well the promo is very interesting for Saturday I don't know what a CM Punk comes out and says that cannot in some way reference where he's been and everything that has happened and nor does I think I feel that fan base want to hear him come out and and skirt issues or avoid the topic entirely so I mean that's why I think like who's going to avoid it either so I I see it as short term it's very good for collision because of that curiosity of what you will say but if it is not a direction that they are pointing you towards then I do see it as a long term negative that this audience I just don't know if they're necessarily going to just accept and move on when this is you're essentially structuring these two programs because of this real life issue but this real life issue is not going to be capitalized on or delivered to your audience for the reasons we've gone over right and this may plan to whether whether he stays a face and whether he whether he comes here later on he depending on how the crowd reacts to him but I expect him to be face for a while anyway anything else major that jumped out at you at the some of the comments made or towards just where they are heading towards you know we talked a bit about where Canada is in terms of I did the United States yes exactly where they where they are in terms of all of these dates that are coming up we've talked about the United Center numbers but yeah the collision dates in Canada they've been very soft sales for Toronto for Hamilton Regina is around 13 1400 Calgary about 3500 so that's what they're looking at over the next month with a lot of collision dates in Canada and I have received a lot of feedback from non TSM plus fans here in Canada not a popular service branded you were the fan relations representative for all Canadian wrestling I think I make all these decisions about where all these programs are in Canada I determine all of this stuff and people voice their displeasure with me why why is it not on television I it is on TSM plus that is that is where it is going to be streaming the Saturday night did you have any any takeaways other than what we talked about I mean I I thought that we tried to cover as much of kind of like a well-rounded picture of where eight eight about 30 minutes we we had 30 minutes and we we were pretty good on our on our time hitting our times and yeah I mean obviously there's certain areas where you want him to go into more depth but you also go into this knowing that there are topics he is not going to go into that does not preclude us from asking them though and I feel we had to ask those questions and I thought in terms of you know just getting some of the television information like I mean it's not outright confirming anything but I thought it was as much clarity as we have heard about several things that I think that it again the option I think being picked up I think everyone has to be under the working assumption that that is going to continue through 2024 and then it sets up like a huge you know decision for Warner Brothers Discovery next year and how they approach AEW is WWE truly something that they are going to go after and with the deals being up so close to one another what what bleed over is there between the two and other broadcasters that are after WWE that see this alternative and like that's that's the major story in wrestling for this year next yeah I would be really curious to know to what degree is AEW really going to be shopped around is it even going to go into a non-exclusive window as Wres deals with Fox and NBC you now have and obviously we get the impression that W is they are now on the open market and you got Andrew Martian of the New York Post reporting FX is interested in WWE content and that's that's the biggest factor that's going to determine whether or not the rights are going to go up and how much is going to go up how many bidders are there how many how many people are going to run this price up in the case of AEW that's totally unclear to me whether the relationship between AEW and WBD is so close that they'll renew within the exclusive window whether WBD owns a piece of of AEW and that's going to encourage that the two to continue working together and preclude any you know shopping around on the open market whether AEW's newness as a brand makes it less attracted to other other bidders as opposed to WB which has been around for decades in this wall mill um these are all questions I have and I guess because their questions I sort of lean towards you know thinking some of these answers are unfavorable to to AEW in terms of them being able to attract multiple bidders and therefore get a higher price than they would otherwise for the TB rights. There's also another big story another big name that is in the hat that we haven't talked about yet Brandon uh we have a clip here this is from uh the Andrew Martian John O'Rant podcast let's hear from John O'Rant because this is this is a big news for years I ignored the WWE because it was the the the the the right deals were basically being negotiated by entertainment executives as a so now that it is you know Mark Silverman and Eric Shanks and and Jimmy Pataro and Marie Donahue and you have actually in in the sports departments they're the ones that are out there doing it they it became more real for me to cover. I heard John O'Rant pro wrestling reporter officially broken on the O'Rant and Martian podcast this week so John O'Rant entering the pro wrestling mix he will be covering these television negotiations. I guess he's saying you know he's he's a sports business journal reporter and these are and then it's apparently case for a W2 I mean judging by how their position at the upfronts they were um included not with sports but with other forms of entertainment and they're under the umbrella of Kathleen Finch who's you know governing scripted entertainment for WBD rather than oh I forget the the executives name who does WBD sports um so I know along those lines there was news recently I've really Pete Bavacqua who's the executive that runs NBC sports he's leaving NBC you um and there was discussion on this podcast from the clip that you played from um that maybe Rick Cardella who's in charge of peacock maybe the one who's gonna fill in uh that they can see. Yes so if you miss uh Andrew Martian's report earlier this week he was you know still of the belief that NBC universal and Fox are the favorites to retain Ron Smackdown respectively however FX is in the mix Amazon Prime is in the mix and then he had some dark horse candidates and included Warner Brothers Discovery in that dark horse department and adding the tidbit that there is not a exclusivity regarding AEW which uh Tonicon would not uh confirm or deny in the in the interview but would be suggested that that is accurate and would not have Warner Brothers Discovery from trying to become the the pro wrestling network which is different from what we what I believe about WB's deals with NBCU and with Fox um at least according to the the MLW lawsuit that's ongoing between MLW and WB I mean MLW mentions in their complaint and in in their filings that WB has an exclusive deal with NBCU for wrestling exclusive deal with Fox for wrestling um not as certain about Fox but in the case of NBCU we saw that when Reels was put as a live stream on to peacock they were they were not streaming the MLW show when that was on to them Tuesdays at 10 so that would certainly have credibility to the notion that NBCU has it has an exclusive agreement for wrestling with WWE but apparently not reportedly not with uh with in the case of AW and WBD and I think that's just you know who's got the leverage there it's a newer brand AEW is and WBD is certainly the one who has the leverage that's why among other reasons why AEW gets paid a lot less than WWE um so there's less that they need to give to retain AEW I suppose and then complicating matters is still the very real discussion point out there about the possibility down the road of NBCU universal buying or merging with Warner Brothers Discovery that would be no sort of that would be a cataclysmic it just business story and how that would play into things as well and that's you know a very heavily discussed subject of Warner Brothers Discovery even though David Zazlaw has denied we are not for sale which no executive they have ever denied that they are for sale before they are sold that just does not happen they would never mislead the public yes especially not the only wrestling fan David Zazlaw as we have confirmed in our interview as well so thank you again to Tony Khan for joining us and we have a few topics that we wanted to discuss as well including the raw numbers from Monday so this was their last night against the NBA finals which wrapped up with the Denver Nuggets winning on Monday night and it did take a big chunk out of raw which fell 13% to a million 595,000 viewers and a 0.46 in the demo so this was their third lowest second lowest viewership of the year third lowest 18 to 49 audience of the year and they just did not get off to a it was a normal start in hour one but they did not get the usual climb in hour two and then following under 1.5 million viewers in the third hour so it as well as they have held up through the playoffs it did feel like this week with the Miami Heat facing elimination this was a week where raw did get hurt by the playoffs in a more significant fashion than we have seen because the numbers have held up very well this spring yeah the attrition on this this episode was fairly heavy I mean the basketball game I believe started at 8.15 or 8.30 got the Cody Rhodes match in before the game began because I think the game started just after 8.30 okay so the I mean the the viewership retention for raw for some of these episodes lately has been better than than usual but yeah they the audience declined a lot more than it has in recent weeks but it's not out of the out of the the normal trend for what it's done historically going years back either so I don't know we'll you know sort of chalk it up to it was going against the NBA finals and see if there's a continued trend next week they were still first on cable and barring any you know that there's the home run derby in July but there should be a pretty clear path until Monday night football returns for raw to be in a pretty favorable setting throughout the summer NXT as well as a very interesting show to be watching because they are throwing everything against the wall they continue to send main roster talent over and they announce it the next two weeks are going to be themed as gold rush with title matches highlighted by Seth Rollins defending the world championship against Braun Breaker next Tuesday and then the big draw Baron Corbin challenging Carmelo Hayes in two weeks so you have two weeks to get ready for Baron Corbin challenging for the NXT title but most of all the TV rights renewal challenge match that is it these rights are up in the fall and they're just loading up NXT which has finished 4th and 5th over the last two weeks on cable Tuesday nights and it seems that they are they are throwing a lot against the wall it seems inevitable that these they're unifying the women's tag titles so that would suggest that you'll get a ronda rousey match at some point on NXT we'll see if this makes any meaningful difference for NXT and what what its value is as its own property as opposed to an add-on in terms of you know it comes with raw it comes with Smackdown versus just on its own and if USA just renews this at another we get a small press release that a multi-year agreement has been reached you know the value attached to it it if I'm in BCU like I'm I'm sure they're in communication but if if I'm in to see you at what I would want some reassurance like how do I know you're not just cramming for the test and that when we you know renew a deal or whoever buys these rights that they're going to get a show that is you know that it that this much star power is being poured into is this a permanent strategy we want Baron Corbin every week yes you want assurances to this yes Baron Corbin and bring hijacks back well Dana Brooke Dana Brooke looks to be a semi-regular for the foreseeable future as well so that that's what you have to look forward to on the NXT front we also do have some super chats so I did stipulate at the beginning that we had spoken to Tony on Monday so if question came here for Tony we will we will do our best to to answer it or or Brandon will no comment it well should we should we answer it in the style of Tony con yes any inkling of a fresh collision commentary team do you imagine there's a lot of broadcasters under contract to AEW between Ring of Honor and AEW I imagine they're going to keep it in house as opposed to going elsewhere and bringing in anybody else I know that more Renault's name has been speculated by some but given his showtime boxing commitments I don't know if a Saturday night program is going to work for more Renault's schedule and Jim Ross me const the effect that he's busy do you prefer the idea of a two-man team or a two-person team if as opposed to the three that AEW seems married to I have no preferences about this but I would prefer two rather than three yes okay well another one here well could I ask Tony no you can't Peter how things are for the Wimbley Stadium show buzzing as I've been following this madness since its inception no debt will be historic thanks to Tony for bringing the mega show closer to me well Peter Brogan that's what Tony con steady said you know what Peter Brogan has been a loyal fan let's book Wimbley for Peter Brogan he is going to bring you that card and as he stated in the interview he if all goes well for Ben Dore it will be a great event I didn't expect them to say you know what it's it's going to be an okay card where we're just you know we'll we'll throw some things together last minute other ones here all right well he enjoyed the interview this from from ten rusa well thank you very much for for for the kind words there and of course Jake one of Tony con's better interviews prop to him and props to you for some great questions in your professionalism all right I'm I'm a I'm averse to reading compliments for myself so I'm not trying to get involved by people if you if you are so kind Ron and XC go ahead and salt us please go forward big time backster raw and NXT both had collision ads airing on the USA network okay well that's a interesting tidbit because I would imagine that's in your local market yes yeah yeah so I mean smart on their part not the first time that we have seen had they've done this before yeah yeah so have you I know that we talked about it last week and you guys chatted about it on sunday on wrestlenomics has your your range of expectation for the debut episode change it all or it's relatively the same of what you're expecting like in line with what dynamite is doing I I made a prediction that it would do I don't know sort of whatever the dynamite two weeks ago did I think like so like a point three or something like that maybe someone in the neighborhood of eight hundred thousand viewers um Jesse and goal although both went lower so it kind of scares me to think that maybe I'm I'm the high man here so I wouldn't be surprised if it's lower um but that's what I think he can use whatever dynamite does for one for one night from there somewhere between what rampage and time dynamite does I think is what I expect yes yeah I'm I'm still of the of the belief I think a point three is achievable for Saturday I I'm pretty high on the idea of like that day of and punk being back on television it's been a long enough time that I think there is a lot of curiosity and you know between a promo and a main event segment that could get up to three quarters of CM Punk I I think that votes well for the overall health of the show and probably something else strong like maybe tonight we get a number two match that is announced for collision I mean it's it's going to be a beefed up show but it's more so wear collision lands at on a weekly basis and that I can certainly see it um it needs something big to sustain interest and I just don't know if punk alone is going to carry this on a weekly basis maybe he can I mean he is sort of the outlier when it comes to um like he is a difference maker and I don't think anyone is going to disagree with that but this is this show success is very much on his shoulders because you take punk out of the mix and I I don't know what this show looks like if punk is not the key attraction to it yeah and I think in the this is small microtuning but I imagine what how the show will be structured is punk promo in the ring to start 15 minutes or something and then last match I believe Tony even told us it's going to be go on last make something that sound like that so I imagine the main event so yeah I think that's a I am curious what the lead him will be if that makes any difference at all but um is a big bang theory airing on set every night but anyway um I would expect the promo is going to have a bigger audience one because it's earlier in the night second because I think the organic uh interest is is much more on promo than it is on the match their lead in is Avengers Age of Ultron okay so it's three hour movie is your lead in and then coming out of it Brandon you'll want a DVR this uh the Lazarus project episode two is airing immediately afterwards so that's what you get no yes and plus is probably going to send us to a bloopers or uh I don't know tennis or whatever it's going on on Tessa see if we get the core hours for that what we'll do we'll do our best it's it's actually a question I want to ask and this is more a larger philosophical question because it's being discussed at the moment with the whole writer's strike um is one of the the key points that they are raising is the inability to get any sort of data from these streamers and this is certainly like a larger story and as we continue to move to more and more of these streaming platforms like do you feel that in time that this will somewhat break and that there will be sort of an onus on these streamers that they are going to have to be a little bit more transparent than what we currently see because the pressure is going to come from I think a lot of creators and ones that are going to want to know how their shows are performing and you know it's it's it's it does add I think a lot of discussion points and seeing it firsthand in MMA like we we do not get like really solid pay-per-view numbers anymore for UFC and that has eliminated a lot of who was a draw who is not a draw the ultimate questions of successor failure in life but it was a totally different world when you have to pay-per-view numbers were routinely reported and a guy like Demetrius Johnson like that was a tag that really held him down was his pay-per-view numbers and I'm just curious if we are going to see an evolution when it comes to you know if if Smackdown goes to an Amazon Prime and maybe this is one or two uh television cycles from now do you expect more reliable data to come out I hope so I mean we did get Nielsen numbers for the Amazon Prime NFL game that's right yeah um I would be curious to know how this is working out in the advertising industry what's the currency the reason why Nielsen TV viewers numbers exist is is largely because that's the currency that people are using that advertisers are using with networks to buy ads because raw does a 4.6 in the demo um that's that's determining how much that add costs basically um so I would I would think they're giving them some kind of internal data to tell them we're going to give you x number of 18 to 49 people or whatever demo you're interested in buying accounts at some point though it would be nice to have a third independent party be the one producing this data rather than you know the the network itself um and certainly I I want to have all the data I can from all the independent third parties we can to analyze it and to look at you know what's uh what the viewership of these shows are and everybody's got sort of a different wait wait to measure it we see that already with social media you know see on Facebook it's three seconds counts as if you are something and then on another platform it's 10 seconds um we've got some peacock numbers right we've we've heard a little bit about not just percentages we have started to hear a little bit about uh being being leaked out there the number of viewers that's some of these PLAs are doing however that's the one they're a big number they will come out and that of course only one is a big number and I think that that is a larger issue is just the idea of like what are what are what are what are the average now and this is not just for for peacock this is like all streaming services of those numbers are would it be a shock to people to see what the actual average numbers are as they compare to television um you know i would you got real numbers that we've gotten are not like to like against say Ross TV viewers who were snackdowns TV viewership that's an average by the minute number of viewers what we what we've heard from the peacock numbers so far is these are a number of people who accounts that actually turn it on so that just means they turned it on that's it i would be curious how much you know significant data WWE is receiving from peacock at at this point like i'm sure they're getting meaningful information but i'm sure it's a far cry from when it was obviously when it was in house and they that that was the big George Barrio's philosophy was like we will remember the famous um we thought they could sell their data nobody wanted to buy that that was the big presentation like the idea of you know we would have all this information we know what kind of shirts everyone is by like he wanted a that brought back Goldberg because people were watching Goldberg stuff on the network supposedly and these thing that was it that was it yeah i don't know if i uh shared the story but when Jim Ross was doing one of his one-man shows here in Toronto it was the afternoon of the survivor series in Toronto which was the night Goldberg beat Brock in however many seconds it was and during the show uh Barry Bloom the the the the mysterious Barry Bloom showed up backstage and he had like the agent of Goldberg the agent of Goldberg also represents Chris Jericho many others and he had like an envelope with him and was on his way i believe to the Scotia bank arena afterward and it was always like the discussion was like they they kind of hammered out a deal that day so i don't know if i was in the presence of uh whatever deal was pending for one Goldberg to do WrestleMania the next year or not but perhaps he was a busy man so what we'll get Barry Bloom on in the in the near future we'll uh we'll we'll go through i'm sure he'd be more than willing to share every every last secret that he has been privy to lie that would be nice well on that note uh we are going to wind things down on this very big edition of Pollock and Thurston now the pressure is on to follow up next week as we are going into Forbidden Door Brandon is going to be coming up to Toronto for Forbidden Door weekend he will also be at the Forbidden Poor which is happening on June 25th in the afternoon we're going to be doing a live session of Ask Away will you be making it to the Forbidden Poor Brandon? I will be now you just advertise me live edition of Pollock and Thurston will be part of the pre-show Q&A we will get Brandon up there on stage Brandon will be the big draw we might have to cut him into the to the earnings of such uh but you can go get your tickets post wrestling.com slash live and then there will be an after party this is that real sports bar right across the street from the Scotia Bank Arena minutes from the venue come back after Forbidden Door and hang out with all of us and that is going to wrap up uh this week's edition of Pollock and Thurston uh what can people go check out on the wrestlingomics patreon you wrote uh an opinion piece on on Tuesday kind of going through some of the discussion that we had what is what can be found at the wrestling may wrestlingomics patreon yeah there's a there's a summary a little bit of analysis on on the latest reports from Anna Martian in New York posted about effects being interested um and other details that are a part of his report also I wrote an opinion piece about whether or not DW and UFC merger are really going to affect uh EW and uh huge pan spoiler I don't think it's going to affect them greatly but you can read about why they're um there's some trademark news in there too about GCW's um fight forever if fight forever trademark I don't want to call it um an opposition they requested time to oppose that the time was granted and now has passed so who knows if something was agreed to be on the scenes but it doesn't look like they're opposing that after all um and some other reason notes including we have wrestling ratings the only place to get those my chart I mean they're they're stunning because yes nobody talks about this show but um more sometimes more total I don't know about more but very close to the total viewership of rampage you could say it's it's certainly bigger than any of your what I would call like third level like pro wrestling programming like this is sometimes doing double if not probably some weeks triple what impact is doing right and there you go I mean it's a very strong syndication package and it is this mystery to me that I am not kidding I have never gotten a piece of feedback on women of wrestling I have never been tweeted about women of wrestling obviously there are people watching it and I just wonder if it's this silo or a wine to wow show once I start to rewind a wow has not been justified on our end to uh to to launch but Brandon um you and you and golo it could be all yours if you if you so choose rewind a wow um but that is it for us maybe maybe we'll get genie bus on the show at some point we'll talk about wow uh which does air in Canada here through a CHCH Braden Harrington is the hook up here for women of wrestling in uh in in Canada that's going to wrap things up uh tomorrow thursday on post wrestling cafe.com myself and waiting we are going to be reviewing ROH is best in the world from 2011 if you are jogging your memory this featured uh debut Richards winning the ROH championship and a big angle involving Kevin Steen the future Kevin Owens as he returned to ROH to launch his attack on Jim Cornett and the entire company so we are gonna go back to 2011 the day before CM Punk's pipe bomb promo this was the angle that everyone thought would be circulating the wrestling world in 24 hours later CM Punk cut a pretty memorable in Las Vegas so you can catch that as well as tonight rewind a dynamite here on the post youtube channel at ten eastern following dynamite in washington dc the site of the very first dynamite so that's it for us for Brandon thirst and i am john paulich we are here every week on the post wrestling and wrestle nomics youtube channels come back next week tell all your friends and that wraps it up goodbye start your summer but save your money now at cucklin four get three point nine percent financing and three thousand dollars customer cash on new twenty twenty three four to explore excel t or two zero point nine percent for sixty months on new twenty twenty two four to edge visit cucklin ford in patasca la heath and circleville or cucklin ford.com cucklin has a cop for you all that pre rebates to deal with the food credits or ford mode of credit cd for details and seven five twenty three for the ones who know safety isn't a catchphrase it's a culture and the ones who help make sure everyone makes it home safe for the safety minded who watch everyone's backs grainger offers supplies and solutions for every industry as well as safety assessments and training to keep your facility safe and your people safer call click grainger.com or just out by grainger for the ones who get it done